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  Grumman Lunar Module (LM) insignias (Page 5)

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Author Topic:   Grumman Lunar Module (LM) insignias
Kevin T. Randall
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Posts: 458
From: High Wycombe, Bucks UK
Registered: Dec 2008

posted 05-24-2011 07:57 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Kevin T. Randall   Click Here to Email Kevin T. Randall     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I've now received my complete sets of these Fabulous LM patches, and would like to praise Chris for all his fantastic work in reviving this project, and seeing it through to it's conclusion.

I also liked the idea of the individual pictorial envelopes used to dispatch each of these patches. A touch of real class!

Many thanks Chris.

perineau
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Posts: 42
From: FRANCE
Registered: Jul 2007

posted 05-24-2011 12:11 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for perineau   Click Here to Email perineau     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
The patches are very nice indeed. But wasn't there a patch for the Apollo 9 (LEM 3) mission?

GoesTo11
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From: Denver, CO USA
Registered: Jun 2004

posted 05-24-2011 12:48 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for GoesTo11   Click Here to Email GoesTo11     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
This page cited earlier in the thread shows patches for LM-1 and LM-3, but my understanding was that Chris elected not to reproduce them because he couldn't source the artwork or verify their provenance.

spaced out
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From: Paris, France
Registered: Aug 2003

posted 05-24-2011 02:19 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for spaced out   Click Here to Email spaced out     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
The LM-4 through 12 insignias were created by the Grumman teams working at the Bethpage plant and produced as decals and prints, never as patches.

The LM-1 patch is certainly original but was likely produced at KSC, not Bethpage and only ever existed as an embroidered patch. As such it does not fit directly in the set I produced.

The LM-3 patch is still something of a mystery. I've never seen a decal or print of any LM-3 artwork so it's not part of that set. Maybe it was produced at the time by someone but I'm not 100% convinced. The fact that it's a very crude design doesn't help its case either.

There's also the LM-13 patch which I'm pretty sure is a modern 'fantasy' creation. I've certainly not seen a vintage decal or print of the design.

Anyway, that's my take on the other Grumman LM insignias and why they don't form part of my project. I might make an LM-1 replica at some stage but that would be a separate project.

kosmo
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Posts: 196
From:
Registered: Sep 2001

posted 09-19-2011 08:31 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for kosmo     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Does anyone know if all the original Grumman Lunar Module insignia, LM-4 thru LM-12, were produced as stickers, water release decals and prints, or were just some and not others? I'm just wondering if there are three variations of each insignia.

Editor's note: Threads merged.

Obviousman
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Posts: 427
From: NSW, Australia
Registered: May 2005

posted 09-23-2011 07:27 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Obviousman   Click Here to Email Obviousman     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
There is no-one on collectSPACE that could verify the LM-3 patch?

Ken Havekotte
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Posts: 1823
From: Merritt Island, Florida, Brevard
Registered: Mar 2001

posted 09-23-2011 07:51 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Ken Havekotte   Click Here to Email Ken Havekotte     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Yes, I can, as I didn't see this topic earlier on cS. I'll provide more info-details later on as I'll be away from my computer most of the day.

Anyway, the small LM-3 patch was indeed produced by Grumman mainly for their workers here at Kennedy. My sources are coming from retired Grumman lunar module checkout and test team members, that I am still in contact with and have known for years.

Indeed, the original triangular-shaped yellow-red-blue patch is extremely hard to come by (I only have 2 of them) and it would appear that most Grumman/KSC workers do not have them either.

More to come as time permits (and I'll have some remarks about the Grumman/LM vinyl decal stickers, too)...

spaced out
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From: Paris, France
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posted 09-23-2011 09:41 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for spaced out   Click Here to Email spaced out     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I do have the LM-3 on my Crew Patches site, with the following description at present:
It appears to be a vintage patch, and although the rather crude design does not form part of the series of LM insignias produced by the Grumman teams working at Bethpage it may possibly have been produced by a Grumman employee based at the KSC.
Ken's post above appears to confirm the KSC origin.

Obviousman
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From: NSW, Australia
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posted 09-23-2011 05:29 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Obviousman   Click Here to Email Obviousman     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Does that mean we are going to see some new replica patches we can add to the collection?

mama04
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Posts: 125
From: Haarlem, N-H, Netherlands
Registered: Sep 2010

posted 09-24-2011 03:09 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for mama04   Click Here to Email mama04     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
'Only' two Ken?

I have one as well, I provided the scan for Chris' excellent website. They are extremely rare, very hard to find and therefore very expensive (trust me, I know from experience!)

hoorenz
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Posts: 733
From: The Netherlands
Registered: Jan 2003

posted 09-24-2011 04:58 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for hoorenz   Click Here to Email hoorenz     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
You bought the $725 one from Luncar Legacies?

mama04
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Posts: 125
From: Haarlem, N-H, Netherlands
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posted 09-24-2011 07:05 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for mama04   Click Here to Email mama04     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Good guess, I did. With the current exchange rates it was (just) affordable.

butch wilks
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Posts: 190
From: Lowestoft, Suffolk, UK
Registered: Mar 2007

posted 09-25-2011 01:45 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for butch wilks   Click Here to Email butch wilks     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Chris, I do hope you will consider adding the LM-3 insignias to to your fantastic LM patch set plus a few more from KSC.

We all know your LM set is based on the decals and prints created at the Bethpage plant, but I think the LM decals, prints and patches created at KSC are just as important, not only to us but to the worker for Grumman at the Cape at the time, who did fantastic work getting all the flight LMs up to spec.

You just have to look into the background of the flight LM to see the good work their people did to get them to the ready for the moon, and it would be a pity to miss them out just for working at KSC, would it not?

Chris I do hope that some of the comments on the posting here can persuade you to add few to the set.

arjuna
unregistered
posted 09-25-2011 04:49 AM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I second Butch's exhortations, and wish to make a plug for the LM-1 patch in particular. I understand Chris's reasons not to on the first round, but it would make a nice addition.

Hart Sastrowardoyo
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From: Toms River, NJ,USA
Registered: Aug 2000

posted 10-31-2011 04:57 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Hart Sastrowardoyo   Click Here to Email Hart Sastrowardoyo     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
While at the Barnes and Noble at the Smith Haven Mall, I stumbled upon the book Building Moonships: The Grumman Lunar Module which shows the insignia for LM-13 as well as for LM-14, which was to be used on Apollo 20.

(And interestingly, the book asserts that LM-9 was to refurbished for use on Apollo 18, with Cradle of Aviation's LM-13 slated for Apollo 19 and LM-14 for Apollo 20.

arjuna
unregistered
posted 10-31-2011 06:19 AM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Huh. Right you are, on the very last page.

The author of the book is Joshua Stoff, who as of the book's printing in 2004, is (according to the back cover) author of sixteen books on aviation and space history [and] curator of the Cradle of Aviation Museum on Long Island. The back cover also says that "the book includes many never before published photographs from the extensive archives of the Cradle of Aviation Museum".

This lends support to the idea that the LM-13 insignia was real. (Although why wouldn't it have flown on Apollo 18, not 19 as it asserts?) Evidence, not proof - but given the proximity of CAM to the former Grumman facility, it's more compelling than if it came from some other source.

I had a quick look (very quick!) at the CAM website but didn't see a staff listing link, so don't know if Stoff is still at the museum.

spaced out
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From: Paris, France
Registered: Aug 2003

posted 02-18-2012 04:41 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for spaced out   Click Here to Email spaced out     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
My Grumman LM-1 / APOLLO-5 replica patch is now ready for pre-order:

See announcement here.

garyd2831
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Posts: 442
From: Syracuse, New York, USA
Registered: Oct 2009

posted 02-18-2012 07:40 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for garyd2831   Click Here to Email garyd2831     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I love these patches! The only weird grumble I have and its no fault of Chris is who ever designed the LM-4 patch wasn't thinking to clearly. Why would you use a three leaf clover and not a four leaf for LM-4?

Plus a four leaf has better luck anyway.

arjuna
unregistered
posted 02-18-2012 10:08 PM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Just ordered two. Thanks Chris, these look great but that's just par for the course given your stellar efforts on other patches in the series (you don't consider them part of the same series but I do for all intents and purposes).

We asked and you delivered - thanks!

Tom
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From: New York
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posted 02-19-2012 10:10 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Tom   Click Here to Email Tom     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Chris, was there ever a thought of producing a patch for LM-2, similar to the ones produced for the Mercury flights... post mission? Possibly depicting it's original earth-orbiting Apollo 8 mission?

Congratulations on doing such a fantastic job!

(Also, on the LM-3 patch, the lower right corner looks like the launch vehicle, however I'm having difficulty identifying what is on the lower left corner.)

Apollo 8
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From: Vienna, AUSTRIA
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posted 02-29-2012 07:09 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Apollo 8   Click Here to Email Apollo 8     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I received my LM-1 patch today (together with the LM-4 patch and a fine LB Apollo 8 patch) from Chris!

Chris, You did a great job on doing this LM-1 replica! It looks BEAUTIFUL!!!

mama04
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Posts: 125
From: Haarlem, N-H, Netherlands
Registered: Sep 2010

posted 02-29-2012 11:26 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for mama04   Click Here to Email mama04     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I can only say that this again is a wonderfully executed patch. Received mine today and it looks just fabulous! If it were not for the 'made in China' sticker on the back you would think it was an original. I compared the two and it is really well done

Thank you Chris, I look forward to your next project!

mooncollector
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From: Alabama, USA
Registered: Feb 2011

posted 03-06-2012 08:29 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for mooncollector   Click Here to Email mooncollector     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
And I also have received mine. Finding this design (along with the impending end of the shuttle program last year) really got me back into the patch collecting hobby after it had lain dormant with me for a while.

Getting that Apollo 5 replica (which is fantastic and virtually indistinguishable from the original) sort of marks my 1st anniversary on this site! It has been a great year, including that view I had of STS-135 coming in, silhouetted against the lightening sunrise as I stood out there at the Wildlife Refuge HQ entrance... I saw my first, and last, shuttle landing up close. Unforgettable.

And through eBay transactions I have been in contact with many of the leading posters on this site. You all have been great! You can look forward to making even more $$$ from me this coming year.

arjuna
unregistered
posted 03-06-2012 11:32 PM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Yes, the patch looks fantastic and I highly recommend it to anyone who might be sitting on the fence.

mach3valkyrie
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From: Albany, Oregon USA
Registered: Jul 2006

posted 03-07-2012 01:26 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for mach3valkyrie   Click Here to Email mach3valkyrie     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
A great looking patch that really tops off the previous patches in this series. Beautifully done! Thanks Chris.

garyd2831
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Posts: 442
From: Syracuse, New York, USA
Registered: Oct 2009

posted 03-07-2012 07:56 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for garyd2831   Click Here to Email garyd2831     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Chris, again a job WELL DONE!

I also like the artwork on the envelope which is different from the patch itself. What is the history behind the envelope artwork?

GoesTo11
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From: Denver, CO USA
Registered: Jun 2004

posted 03-07-2012 09:39 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for GoesTo11   Click Here to Email GoesTo11     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
It is indeed another beautiful production, especially considering how challenging the design must have been to reproduce.

As for the envelope, the art appears to be a thematic tie-in to Chris' crewpatches.com website design, rather than specific to individual patches as he's done to this point.

spaced out
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From: Paris, France
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posted 03-08-2012 12:56 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for spaced out   Click Here to Email spaced out     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I did make an LM-1 specific 'cachet' design but some of you might not have received that particular envelope as I ran out at one stage.

The design was obviously based on the LM-1 patch design but with the artwork cobbled together from other sources.

spaced out
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From: Paris, France
Registered: Aug 2003

posted 05-26-2012 04:54 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for spaced out   Click Here to Email spaced out     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
My Grumman LM-3 replica patch is now available to order:

Please see the announcement here.

Apollo 8
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Posts: 166
From: Vienna, AUSTRIA
Registered: Oct 2010

posted 05-26-2012 11:51 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Apollo 8   Click Here to Email Apollo 8     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Great, Chris! You did it!

I was real waiting for this one. I have collected one Apollo astronaut's autograph per flown mission and framed it starting with Apollo X together with the matching Lion Brothers patch and your Grumman replica patch (for the Apollo 7 and 8 missions I had a Lion Brothers and 25th Anniversary patch to have two patches framed with the autographed picture).

Thanks for doing the LM-3 patch! - I have ordered one for me right now and I will frame it together with Rusty Schweickart's autograph...

On edit: I have put your beautiful LM-1 Patch in my collection of Apollo patches. Has there ever been a LM-2 patch?

mooncollector
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Posts: 75
From: Alabama, USA
Registered: Feb 2011

posted 05-27-2012 04:05 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for mooncollector   Click Here to Email mooncollector     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I KNEW this was going to happen at some point.

Glad you decided to do this one also, and I have ordered mine.

IF it's possible, could I request a special envelope for it, and maybe also for the LM-1 from last year if you have any now available (I was one of those who didn't get one with that patch when it was sent...)

Haven't talked myself into getting the full Grumman set yet but I will definitely be getting at least a couple of them at some point later. Thanks!

Apollo 8
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Posts: 166
From: Vienna, AUSTRIA
Registered: Oct 2010

posted 05-31-2012 05:24 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Apollo 8   Click Here to Email Apollo 8     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I received mine today. Another fine LM patch and a beautiful envelope too! Thanks Chris, for doing these wonderful series of patches.

astroborg
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Posts: 170
From: Woodbridge, VA, USA
Registered: Nov 2000

posted 06-05-2012 06:37 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for astroborg   Click Here to Email astroborg     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I received my LM-3 patch yesterday, and second the above posters' comments. Another excellent rendition, commissioned by Chris!

arjuna
unregistered
posted 06-12-2012 03:01 AM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Thanks, Chris. Order placed. The LM-3 patches arrived the other day and look great. Thanks for doing these series(es - if that is a word). Top notch all the way.

Gonzo
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Posts: 374
From: Lansing, MI, USA
Registered: Mar 2012

posted 06-12-2012 05:17 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Gonzo   Click Here to Email Gonzo     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Thanks from me too, Chris. Placed my first order yesterday. From reading these posts, I'm looking forward to getting my first few. Sounds like I'll be ordering the rest of them too.


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