Space News
space history and artifacts articles

Messages
space history discussion forums

Sightings
worldwide astronaut appearances

Resources
selected space history documents

Websites
related space history websites

  collectSPACE: Messages
  Space Places
  Cape Canaveral launch complexes and facilities (Page 6)

Post New Topic  Post A Reply
profile | register | preferences | faq | search


This topic is 8 pages long:   1  2  3  4  5  6  7  8 
next newest topic | next oldest topic
Author Topic:   Cape Canaveral launch complexes and facilities
Jim Behling
Member

Posts: 681
From: Cape Canaveral, FL
Registered: Mar 2010

posted 08-10-2012 08:58 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Jim Behling   Click Here to Email Jim Behling     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Larry McGlynn:
The NRO is there and so is SpaceX and a number of civilian businesses too.
They have all been vetted.
quote:
...maybe that will help with the NASA budget.
The money goes back into the visitor center. Also, any money NASA receives goes back into the US general fund and not to NASA.

LM-12
Member

Posts: 1107
From: Ontario, Canada
Registered: Oct 2010

posted 08-10-2012 09:34 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for LM-12     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
This is an interesting photo of JFK in a motorcade outside the "Pre-Flight Operations Division" (Hangar S) at Cape Canaveral in September 1962.

Larry McGlynn
Member

Posts: 819
From: Boston, MA
Registered: Jul 2003

posted 08-11-2012 12:49 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Larry McGlynn   Click Here to Email Larry McGlynn     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
So I guess there won't be any lucites then.

capoetc
Member

Posts: 1755
From: Newnan GA (USA)
Registered: Aug 2005

posted 09-30-2012 07:42 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for capoetc   Click Here to Email capoetc     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Someone has started a petition to save Hangar S...

Also included on the page is a link to a Nov. '61 Roundup newspaper describing Hangar S operations. I never realized the altitude chamber for Mercury spacecraft checkout was also located inside Hangar S.

ilbasso
Member

Posts: 1501
From: Greensboro, NC USA
Registered: Feb 2006

posted 11-01-2012 01:50 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for ilbasso   Click Here to Email ilbasso     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Just got back from the Patrick AFB tour and were VERY disappiointed. Our tour guide was relatively new, I believe, and he did not manage time well. On a tour scheduled for 3 hours, we spent nearly 90 minutes at the LC 26 blockhouse and museum, and half an hour at the lighthouse. By the time we turned onto ICBM Rd., there wasn't enough time for us to even get off the bus at the Mercury monument, let alone go out to the launch pad. We didn't even stop at the Gemini sign. We ended up seeing less of the CCAFS facilities than on the KSC Then & Now tour.

We left some pretty strongly-worded feedback, but that doesn't give us back an opportunity to go to the sites we missed.

GACspaceguy
Member

Posts: 1556
From: Guyton, GA
Registered: Jan 2006

posted 11-01-2012 07:05 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for GACspaceguy   Click Here to Email GACspaceguy     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
That's too bad. When done right the tour is great.

LM-12
Member

Posts: 1107
From: Ontario, Canada
Registered: Oct 2010

posted 11-01-2012 07:17 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for LM-12     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
How many people were on the tour?

Jim Behling
Member

Posts: 681
From: Cape Canaveral, FL
Registered: Mar 2010

posted 11-01-2012 08:08 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Jim Behling   Click Here to Email Jim Behling     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by ilbasso:
We left some pretty strongly-worded feedback, but that doesn't give us back an opportunity to go to the sites we missed.
Remember, they are volunteers and you didn't pay anything.

ilbasso
Member

Posts: 1501
From: Greensboro, NC USA
Registered: Feb 2006

posted 11-01-2012 08:53 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for ilbasso   Click Here to Email ilbasso     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I appreciate that they are volunteers. I was a volunteer tour guide at the National Air and Space Museum for several years myself. Our group of 30 or so included a group of people speaking French and families who had come from Ohio, Virginia, and other places out of state.

What bothered me was that the highlights of the tour were totally missed, and there's no way I could come back by myself after the tour to pick up on the missed sections. It would be like me taking a group of out-of-town tourists to one corner of the NASM for several hours, and then ushering them out a side door because the museum's closing now for the rest of the week and there's no time left to see Apollo 11, the Wright Flyer, Friendship 7, or the Spirit of St. Louis.

And although I didn't pay Patrick AFB for the tour, I did pay for an extra day's stay in the hotel by coming down here a day early to take the tour.

LM-12
Member

Posts: 1107
From: Ontario, Canada
Registered: Oct 2010

posted 11-02-2012 07:27 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for LM-12     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Maybe they should change the tour route and go down ICBM row first.

Robert Pearlman
Editor

Posts: 29619
From: Houston, TX
Registered: Nov 1999

posted 11-22-2012 04:06 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Robert Pearlman   Click Here to Email Robert Pearlman     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Malcolm Glenn (mgspacecadet) shares:
...at LC-19 (Gemini Program), the last remains of the service tower have now been removed, and the vehicle launch mount is being demolished/removed.

I talked to one of the workers on site last week who said several weeks of work remain to complete the job.

The top part of the service tower was restored and is at the CCAFS Air Force Museum.

In related news, another blockhouse at CCAFS, Launch Complex 15, is being demolished. Of note, of the blockhouses along ICBM Road, the LC-12 blockhouse (Atlas pad) was demolished in 2009 and the LC-13 blockhouse (another Atlas pad) was demolished earlier this year. LC-15 was a Titan pad.

stargazerken73
New Member

Posts: 5
From: Fort Meade, Fl, USA
Registered: Aug 2012

posted 12-08-2012 02:19 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for stargazerken73   Click Here to Email stargazerken73     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Hello all! I took the CCAFS tour (the Air Force provided tour) last December and I guess we had a more enthusiastic tour guide. He did make one small error when asked about the Gemini white room — he could not remember what it was! I think we were his first or second tour so the gent was a little frazzled.

We did have an older gentleman on board that kept us entertained with stories from the Cape during the late 1950s and early 1960s. He was an engineer that worked with von Braun and Debus on various programs. During the trip along the tour route he would point here and there and tell my dad and I what happened at each of those locations.

I recall that he told us that after each Redstone and Jupiter launch they had to restring the cables in the raceways that connected the pad and the blockhouse due to the fires in the raceways after the launches. To be honest I could have spent the entire day just listening to his stories!

LM-12
Member

Posts: 1107
From: Ontario, Canada
Registered: Oct 2010

posted 01-18-2013 08:54 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for LM-12     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
NASA nurse Dee O'Hara talks about Hangar S in this 2012 AAMS video clip. She is wearing a "Save Hangar S" button.

LM-12
Member

Posts: 1107
From: Ontario, Canada
Registered: Oct 2010

posted 01-21-2013 03:14 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for LM-12     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
This 1962 photo shows the "NASA Manned Spacecraft Center" sign on Hangar S.

Before that, it was different. There was a "NASA Project Mercury" sign on Hangar S. There is a photo in the November 29, 1961 issue of the Space News Roundup. The Hangar S article also has some photos of nurse Dee O'Hara.

The NASA Space News Roundup is a real gold mine of space history.

Jim Behling
Member

Posts: 681
From: Cape Canaveral, FL
Registered: Mar 2010

posted 01-21-2013 04:01 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Jim Behling   Click Here to Email Jim Behling     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
E&O building was just turned over to the USAF from NASA. The KSC Federal Credit Union branch office had to leave after almost 50 years of presence in building. It was first branch when the credit union was chartered the MILA FCU.

LM-12
Member

Posts: 1107
From: Ontario, Canada
Registered: Oct 2010

posted 01-29-2013 05:57 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for LM-12     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Was the suiting room beyond the double doors in the background located on the left or right side of the hallway as seen in this view of the Apollo 16 crew walkout?

Ken Havekotte
Member

Posts: 1984
From: Merritt Island, Florida, Brevard
Registered: Mar 2001

posted 02-04-2013 04:51 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Ken Havekotte   Click Here to Email Ken Havekotte     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
LM-12, just came across this cS posting and let me answer your question(s).

The suiting room (#3287/9) in the O&C Building is beyond the double doors off to the left in the hallway on the third floor.

Once the astronaut crew departed the suiting room area, their next stop would be Elevator #4 that would take them to the first floor and outside to their awaiting astronaut van.

Is this what you wanted to know?

LM-12
Member

Posts: 1107
From: Ontario, Canada
Registered: Oct 2010

posted 02-04-2013 05:02 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for LM-12     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Yes it is Ken. Thanks for that reply -- and the room number.

So if I have the orientation correct, the suiting room is on the south side of the South Wing of the Operations and Checkout Building.

LM-12
Member

Posts: 1107
From: Ontario, Canada
Registered: Oct 2010

posted 02-09-2013 06:26 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for LM-12     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Here is an AmericaSpace blog about the items on display in Hangar R at Cape Canaveral. Hangar R is near Hangar S. Hangar C is near the Cape lighthouse.

LM-12
Member

Posts: 1107
From: Ontario, Canada
Registered: Oct 2010

posted 04-23-2013 12:40 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for LM-12     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
It looks like the Manned Spacecraft Operations Building was a bit smaller when it opened in the fall of 1964. Photo KSC-64C-5543 was taken in November 1964.

Additional construction can be seen in photo KSC-65C-5214 taken in August 1965. That was about five months after the manned Gemini flights began.

Jim Behling
Member

Posts: 681
From: Cape Canaveral, FL
Registered: Mar 2010

posted 04-23-2013 07:06 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Jim Behling   Click Here to Email Jim Behling     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by LM-12:
It looks like the Manned Spacecraft Operations Building
Operations and Checkout Building. That was the name before and after MSOB. It was MSOB for less than a quarter of its life.

Ken Havekotte
Member

Posts: 1984
From: Merritt Island, Florida, Brevard
Registered: Mar 2001

posted 04-23-2013 10:34 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Ken Havekotte   Click Here to Email Ken Havekotte     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Not that it matters too much, but from my understanding, MSOB was the original name that applied all throughout the Gemini and Apollo spacecraft programs.

It had been changed from "Manned Spacecraft Operations Building" (MSOB) to the "Operations and Checkout Building" (O&C) when the terms "Manned Spacecraft..." seemed to no longer apply in all cases.

Why? Because I think once the shuttle program started to get underway after Apollo during the mid/1970s, there were so many different kinds of cargos and payloads that would have to be checked out and processed in the same facility. Most of them, however, would be STS-related though in the coming years.

To me, it really doesn't matter too much, as I am comfortable with both the MSOB and O&C building names. It's all the same place to me!

SpaceKSCBlog
Member

Posts: 116
From: Merritt Island, FL
Registered: Nov 2011

posted 04-27-2013 07:52 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for SpaceKSCBlog   Click Here to Email SpaceKSCBlog     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I saw on the Cape tour today that the old Bioastronautics Operations and Support Unit (BOSU) -- a fancy way of saying the medical clinic -- is being demolished. It was on the corner of Industrial Road and Hangar Road.

This is the building where the Mercury astronauts got their exams. It's also where the remains of the Apollo 1 crew were brought on January 27, 1967.

Sad to see it go. But as with so much of the CCAFS infrastructure, the money and the demand isn't there.

Ken Havekotte
Member

Posts: 1984
From: Merritt Island, Florida, Brevard
Registered: Mar 2001

posted 04-27-2013 08:29 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Ken Havekotte   Click Here to Email Ken Havekotte     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Also known as the Cape Dispensary, the one-story air force BOSU served as a medical clinic, or mini-hospital of sorts, all throughout the Cape-side/CCAFS.

As pointed out, it was here where the Apollo 1 crew were examined after the tragic fire.

During the late 1960s, Hangar Road connected into Cape Road (now called Phillips Parkway) that ended up at Apollo/Saturn 1B Launch Complex 34, just a little over two miles from the clinic, at the heart of the Cape's Industrial Area.

LM-12
Member

Posts: 1107
From: Ontario, Canada
Registered: Oct 2010

posted 04-27-2013 08:36 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for LM-12     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
The medical clinic must be the building seen in this photo S67-21617.

SpaceKSCBlog
Member

Posts: 116
From: Merritt Island, FL
Registered: Nov 2011

posted 04-27-2013 08:53 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for SpaceKSCBlog   Click Here to Email SpaceKSCBlog     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Yep, that's it. The driveway in the back. I've gone through there a few times on my own to see it up close.

Jim Behling
Member

Posts: 681
From: Cape Canaveral, FL
Registered: Mar 2010

posted 04-27-2013 09:19 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Jim Behling   Click Here to Email Jim Behling     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Ken Havekotte:
Not that it matters too much, but from my understanding, MSOB was the original name that applied all throughout the Gemini and Apollo spacecraft programs.
I have documentation pre-dating its construction calling it the O&C.

LM-12
Member

Posts: 1107
From: Ontario, Canada
Registered: Oct 2010

posted 04-27-2013 09:26 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for LM-12     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by SpaceKSCBlog:
Yep, that's it.
It looks like photo S67-21614 was also taken in the CCAFS industrial area. Most likely en route from the medical clinic to the skid strip.

Ken Havekotte
Member

Posts: 1984
From: Merritt Island, Florida, Brevard
Registered: Mar 2001

posted 04-27-2013 10:27 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Ken Havekotte   Click Here to Email Ken Havekotte     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Jim Behling:
I have documentation pre-dating its construction calling it the O&C.
Jim, That may be true, but there is official internal documentation from the facility itself throughout the Gemini/Apollo program years documenting astronaut crew activities and movements within "MSOB," and not as "O&C."

It would be interesting to know if such early documentation you have is of NASA origin, aerospace contractor, or perhaps from construction sources from the early 1960s?

Most of the documentation that I have seen, used by the building supervisors and crew quarters' personnel, refer to the building as MSOB, though, going back to 1965.

J.L
Member

Posts: 476
From: Bloomington, Illinois, USA
Registered: May 2005

posted 04-27-2013 11:56 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for J.L   Click Here to Email J.L     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I concur with Ken.

SpaceKSCBlog
Member

Posts: 116
From: Merritt Island, FL
Registered: Nov 2011

posted 04-28-2013 06:13 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for SpaceKSCBlog   Click Here to Email SpaceKSCBlog     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by LM-12:
It looks like photo S67-21614 was also taken in the CCAFS industrial area.
I could probably identify the location by the power lines in the distance, if they're still around. My guess is Skid Strip Road but that's by no means certain, as there are several routes between BOSU and the Skid Strip.

Jim Behling
Member

Posts: 681
From: Cape Canaveral, FL
Registered: Mar 2010

posted 04-28-2013 09:16 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Jim Behling   Click Here to Email Jim Behling     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Ken Havekotte:
It would be interesting to know if such early documentation you have is of NASA origin, aerospace contractor, or perhaps from construction sources from the early 1960s?
  • MSC AMR Operations Facilities 1959-1964 dated April 15, 1963
  • MSC AMR Operations Pamphlet undated. It is after MA-8 (photo of launch is in the document) and refers to times before summer of 1963.
  • AMR MILA S/C Composite Test Plan Facilities Utilization undated. It uses "LEM" and has Apollo and Gemini using the O&C simultaneously.
  • LOC-63-7629
The description is MSC Operations & Checkout Bldg, MILA.

Jim Behling
Member

Posts: 681
From: Cape Canaveral, FL
Registered: Mar 2010

posted 04-28-2013 10:02 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Jim Behling   Click Here to Email Jim Behling     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by SpaceKSCBlog:
My guess is Skid Strip Road but that's by no means certain, as there are several routes between BOSU and the Skid Strip.
I would say south on Hangar road, just past the E&L and E&O before Skip Strip Road. The Apollo warehouse is on the right and the edge of Cape Commander's Building is on the left.

Ken Havekotte
Member

Posts: 1984
From: Merritt Island, Florida, Brevard
Registered: Mar 2001

posted 04-28-2013 12:05 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Ken Havekotte   Click Here to Email Ken Havekotte     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Jim, Looks as though, from what you're saying, some of the first documents and planning records are indicating "MSC (Manned Spacecraft Center)..." as a possible "O&C" reference, correct?

You got me curious in going back to some of my own early MSC/MILA files and folders with similar reports, which I will do so this week, and report back here later as time permits.

Either way, though, why the facility was named "MSOB" is not completely clear to me if earlier planning and preliminary reports are indicating otherwise.

By the way, though, I did click on your provided link, LOC-63-7269, but the page was not found, as the site had just indicated a few minutes ago.

Also, Jim, you are correct in response to SpaceKSCBlog, regarding the Apollo 1 crew's hearse route to the Cape's Skid Strip from the BOSU.

As reported from veteran space pool reporter Mary Bubb, while covering the Apollo 1 crew's hearse convoy trip on Jan. 30, 1967, reads, in part:

"Departure of the Apollo Crew (from the) Bioastronautic Operational Support Unit;

Fighting back tears with tight lipped determination, two nurses in crisp white uniforms held open the doors through which the bodies of their friends, the three astronauts, were carried in flag-draped caskets to waiting hearses.

Not a word had been spoken.

It was a strange funeral procession that waited for the proper time to depart for the skid strip; a security police car, three hearses, and a one-ton Air Force truck.

The Cape Road was lined with solemn groups of people in clusters and standing alone. Military men stood at attention or saluted. Missilemen held their hands over their hearts. Some of the workmen held their hard hats over their hearts while others battered straw hats. Women shaded their eyes from the sun and wept. Even at a distance, the ravages of tears could be seen on the faces of women closely connected to the program.

The usual buzzing of a crowd, and the cheerful waving were absent. There wasn't a sound except for the motors of the cars in the procession.

The crowds grew larger as the skid strip was approached.

Cape Kennedy wept openly or cried inside for the three who had been their boys."

Jim Behling
Member

Posts: 681
From: Cape Canaveral, FL
Registered: Mar 2010

posted 04-28-2013 01:59 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Jim Behling   Click Here to Email Jim Behling     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Also, when it comes to acronyms, MOSB is the one that is in use since late 80's. It stands for Multi Operations Support Building. It is located in front and slightly to the north of the PHSF.

LM-12
Member

Posts: 1107
From: Ontario, Canada
Registered: Oct 2010

posted 04-28-2013 06:50 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for LM-12     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by SpaceKSCBlog:
It was on the corner of Industrial Road and Hangar Road.
At left-center in this great aerial photo of the CCAFS Industrial Area.

SpaceKSCBlog
Member

Posts: 116
From: Merritt Island, FL
Registered: Nov 2011

posted 04-28-2013 07:03 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for SpaceKSCBlog   Click Here to Email SpaceKSCBlog     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Well, not any more.

I drove over to CCAFS today to shoot photos of the BOSU demolition. They're posted on my blog.

SpaceKSCBlog
Member

Posts: 116
From: Merritt Island, FL
Registered: Nov 2011

posted 04-28-2013 07:08 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for SpaceKSCBlog   Click Here to Email SpaceKSCBlog     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Jim Behling:
I would say south on Hangar road, just past the E&L and E&O before Skip Strip Road. The Apollo warehouse is on the right and the edge of Cape Commander's Building is on the left.
I think you're right.

When I drove over to CCAFS to shoot photos of the BOSU, I looked for what appeared to be the location for the 1967 photo. Of course, that was 46 years ago so things look very different now.

By today's standards, the location would be as you said, between E&O and E&L, just before Hangar S on the right.

If a procession were leaving BOSU, that would be the logical direction to go to the Skid Strip.

Ken Havekotte
Member

Posts: 1984
From: Merritt Island, Florida, Brevard
Registered: Mar 2001

posted 04-28-2013 07:59 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Ken Havekotte   Click Here to Email Ken Havekotte     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
In checking over my Apollo 1 file folders (see my earlier posting here), the hearse convoy left from the back-side of BOSU to Hangar Road heading south-west for about 3/4 of a mile.

From there, turning left (east-south) on Skid Strip Road for another mile to the awaiting air force KC-135 aircraft at the runway apron of the Cape Kennedy Air Force Station.

Here is a little bit more information in case anyone might be interested;

Within 30 minutes of the convoy arrival, the plane would be flying to Andrews AFB in Washington, D.C.

The convoy trip lasted about ten minutes, and once at the air field, there was a military escort (one individual) that were assigned to accompany each casket from the BOSU.

In addition, at planeside, were Maj. Gen. Vincent Huston, Air Force Eastern Test Range Commander, and Dr. Kurt Debus, NASA-Kennedy Space Center Director.

Jan. 30, 1967, was certainly a very sad day for all those at American's spaceport, and for the entire nation as well.

SpaceKSCBlog
Member

Posts: 116
From: Merritt Island, FL
Registered: Nov 2011

posted 04-28-2013 08:02 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for SpaceKSCBlog   Click Here to Email SpaceKSCBlog     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Ken Havekotte:
In checking over my Apollo 1 file folders(see my earlier posting here), the hearse convoy left from the back-side of BOSU to Hangar Road heading south-west for about 3/4 of a mile.
Thanks. That reconciles with the photos of the era.

I tried to get around to where the loading ramp was, but that's the first part that's been demolished. The building is fenced off so it's not easily accessible.


This topic is 8 pages long:   1  2  3  4  5  6  7  8 

All times are CT (US)

next newest topic | next oldest topic

Administrative Options: Close Topic | Archive/Move | Delete Topic
Post New Topic  Post A Reply
Hop to:

Contact Us | The Source for Space History & Artifacts

Copyright 1999-2014 collectSPACE.com All rights reserved.


Ultimate Bulletin Board 5.47a





advertisement