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  Apollo vs. Constellation: Collecting trends

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Author Topic:   Apollo vs. Constellation: Collecting trends
paulushumungus
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Posts: 425
From: Burton, Derbyshire, England
Registered: Oct 2005

posted 12-27-2008 07:52 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for paulushumungus   Click Here to Email paulushumungus     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I suppose Apollo will always be the holy grail to collectors though. It is never the same the second time around is it?

Editor's note: This topic was spun off the Spacefest 2009 thread.

Robert Pearlman
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posted 12-27-2008 07:52 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Robert Pearlman   Click Here to Email Robert Pearlman     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I would liken the relationship between Apollo and Constellation to the voyages of the Santa Maria and the Mayflower. The earlier brought the first visitors, the latter brought people to stay. Both are historically important for their individual accomplishments, but the arrival of the Mayflower added additional meaning to the significance of the Santa Maria.

Likewise, the Constellation lunar missions, if successful, will have an affect on the Apollo memorabilia, enhancing (and I believe, in some cases, detracting) from its significance.

gliderpilotuk
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posted 12-27-2008 07:53 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for gliderpilotuk   Click Here to Email gliderpilotuk     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Robert Pearlman:
Likewise, the Constellation lunar missions, if successful, will have an affect on the Apollo memorabilia, enhancing (and I believe, in some cases, detracting) from its significance.
Timing will be a major influence: how long did it take for Apollo stuff to have real value after the missions? 15yrs? 20yrs? Partly due to the "generational factor" - children of the 60's having disposable income to spend on earlier interests. By the time the Constellation missions (may) have happened there will be a whole new generation of collectors - some of whom will value the continuity of space history; some of whom will only be interested in the "signal" M/G/A missions.

Anyone for a bet on the value of an Apollo 11 crew in 2030?

Paul

ilbasso
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From: Greensboro, NC USA
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posted 12-27-2008 07:53 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for ilbasso   Click Here to Email ilbasso     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by gliderpilotuk:
Anyone for a bet on the value of an Apollo 11 crew in 2030?
There are quite a few Apollo workers who are now passing on and whose private collections are starting to show up here and there. We're seeing more astronauts also putting their items up for auction. Combining this with the success and wide acceptance of eBay, I think we are entering a 'golden age' of Apollo-era memorabilia, in terms of the quantity of what will become available to the general public. I imagine there will be some fantastic items becoming available in the next several years.

As much we may complain about it, eBay (and other less-widely known online auctions) levels the playing field, as it were, making items much more broadly available. The downside is that it's getting harder to find a bargain or coming across the rare goodie at a garage sale. The good news is that you don't have to live on the Space Coast to get good stuff. My guess is that supply and demand may cause the prices to come down a bit, too, as more people jump into selling their goodies.

mjanovec
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posted 12-27-2008 07:55 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for mjanovec   Click Here to Email mjanovec     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I think the biggest factor that will determine value of the Constellation collectibles will be availability... more so than time.

It seems that the appetite among collectors for artifacts from the space program (not just Apollo, but also Mercury, Gemini, and the Shuttle) is at an all-time high at the moment. That high may continue, it may climb, or it may level off. Either way, we're seeing it higher than it was during the 60s/70s. I'm not talking space memorabilia and trinkets manufactured for the common person, but actual artifacts from the program.

When the first Constellation artifacts hit the streets, demand for them will be high... especially due to the limited quantities that initially become available. Like the Apollo program, it may takes decades for private collections from NASA workers and astronauts to hit the market. So it wouldn't surprise me if the prices start out relatively high.

capoetc
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From: Newnan GA (USA)
Registered: Aug 2005

posted 12-27-2008 08:09 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for capoetc   Click Here to Email capoetc     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by paulushumungus:
I suppose Apollo will always be the holy grail to collectors though. It is never the same the second time around is it?
Apollo items may remain the most valuable, but I'm sure collectors will still be interested in collecting items from upcoming programs, even if those items are not necessarily going to increase greatly in value.

I suspect few collectors from the 1970's - 80's ever suspected that their space memorabilia items would one day in the not-so-distant future be selling for so much money.

Interestingly, with many collectibles "scarcity" is of key importance. For example, baseball cards from the 1960's and earlier are valuable because kids played with them and put them in their bike spokes so there are not very many nice copies left in existence.

However, space memorabilia by its very nature is already quite limited in availability making many items relatively scarce when they first become available. Also, space memorabilia is really a niche market, so there aren't that many folks out there competing for the items (except maybe Neil Armstrong WSS lithos).

------------------
John Capobianco
Camden DE

LCDR Scott Schneeweis
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posted 12-27-2008 09:08 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for LCDR Scott Schneeweis   Click Here to Email LCDR Scott Schneeweis     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Depends on which aspect..my interest is Hardware so from that perspective factors to consider:

Project Constellation, in whatever endstate it is deployed will result in quite a bit less residual flight hardware from RDT&E (even though it’s a longer acquisition cycle then Apollo, Constellation development will incur less prototyping of parts and test vehicles due to the availability of computer modeling).

ITAR is in effect and rigidly enforced. Contractors and the Government are being more conservative about how and where they dispose of excess hardware. ISS is a graphic example (how much ISS hardware is actually circulating in collector's inventories?)

If Constellation is stuck in LEO, desirability will be no greater then that of STS artifacts


------------------
Scott Schneeweis
http://www.SPACEAHOLIC.com/

cspg
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From: Geneva, Switzerland
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posted 12-28-2008 12:53 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for cspg   Click Here to Email cspg     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Slightly off-topic, but why on Earth did NASA pick Ares as its program/rocket (funny Constellation is not that mentioned) name? The God of War (and "Ares was always distrusted; Ares's tended to be one of unpredictable violence). Quite a bad omen for any possible international effort...

At least Apollo was the "god of light and the sun; truth and prophecy; archery; medicine and healing; music, poetry, and the arts; and more. (wikipedia)...

And since the Ares program is the Apollo program version 2, why not pick Artemis as a program name? (Apollo's twin sister, "the Hellenic goddess of forests and hills, virginity/fertility, and the hunt and was often depicted as a huntress carrying a bow and arrows.")

Chris.

Linda K
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posted 12-28-2008 06:43 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Linda K   Click Here to Email Linda K     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Chris -

Interestingly enough, just as Apollo was identified with the sun, his twin sister Artemis was associated with the moon. According to Cicero, Sol, the sun, and Luna, the moon, were deities, and the Greeks identified the former with Apollo, and the latter with Artemis. Just thought that was another interesting tidbit to point out in light of your suggestion in your posting! =)

LCDR Scott Schneeweis
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posted 12-28-2008 09:12 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for LCDR Scott Schneeweis   Click Here to Email LCDR Scott Schneeweis     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Von Braun, because he had a propensity to name launch boosters after planets would likely have renamed Ares after the next available one: Uranus (though I doubt he would have been enamored with the current architecture and would have applied/spoken the renamed program with a non-flattering pause between the first and second syllable).

Robert Pearlman
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From: Houston, TX
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posted 12-28-2008 10:19 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Robert Pearlman   Click Here to Email Robert Pearlman     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by cspg:
Slightly off-topic, but why on Earth did NASA pick Ares as its program/rocket (funny Constellation is not that mentioned) name?
See: NASA's history, future inspire rocket name

Constellation is the program name. Ares and Orion are two projects that fall under the program's responsibilities.

Whizzospace
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Posts: 101
From: San Antonio, TX
Registered: Jan 2006

posted 12-28-2008 04:42 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Whizzospace   Click Here to Email Whizzospace     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Hmmm, maybe it's about time someone gets the Pluto planetary status debate dragged into booster naming :-)

David Bryant
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From: Norfolk UK
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posted 12-29-2008 01:43 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for David Bryant   Click Here to Email David Bryant     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Good idea!

We could call the program 'Pluto' and the two booster systems 'Mickey' and 'Donald'

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