posted 07-11-2011 06:45 AM               

Editor's note: In an effort to keep the topic NASA heavy-lift launch vehicle development focused on status updates, readers' feedback and opinions are directed to this thread.

Please use this topic to discuss the Space Launch System as NASA develops its heavy lift launch vehicle.

posted 07-11-2011 06:49 AM               

Am I correct that if all goes well, the first test should be around 2016? Then it seems that the heavy-lift vehicle won't be used much until an asteroid mission in 2025.

posted 07-11-2011 07:00 AM               

Deputy Administrator Lori Garver said here July 7 that NASA will run another internal cost analysis of the shuttle-derived stack chosen by Administrator Charles Bolden last month, in parallel with an outside evaluation by Booz Allen. Both should be done "by late July or early August," she says, clearing the way for a final decision "by the end of the summer."

"We're going through a very difficult period of time as a nation," Bolden said during the run up here for the final space shuttle launch. "The decision on the heavy-lift is going to be a... very critical and very expensive decision for the nation. It's got to carry us into this next era that we hope will extend longer than the 30 years of shuttle. So we're close to making a decision on the configuration, but not quite there."

posted 07-11-2011 07:44 AM               

On the other hand there is the Liberty Launch Vehicle, a five segment SRB first stage, and the Ariane cryogenic as the second stage. This has two advantages in my personal view:

1. Proven technology.
   
2. Euro-US relations.

posted 07-12-2011 07:10 AM               

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Originally posted by Fra Mauro:
I hope they would use VAB facilities and the shuttle launch pads. Why waste those assets?

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posted 07-13-2011 08:24 PM               

This was noted today in a statement released by Sen. Kay Bailey Hutchinson:

"We now have it confirmed that a final technical design decision on the heavy lift vehicle was made three weeks ago, on June 20th. Although the studies leading to that design decision included independent cost estimates, the Office of Management and Budget (OMB) has deferred endorsing that technical decision until it can see another independent cost analysis for the project."

posted 07-29-2011 06:46 AM               

A Senate panel issued a subpoena ordering NASA to produce internal documents related to the agency’s progress on the Space Launch System (SLS), the heavy-lift rocket Congress ordered NASA to make ready for flight by Dec. 31, 2016.

The Senate Commerce, Science and Transportation Committee, whose members were the architects of the NASA Authorization Act of 2010 that created SLS, took the unusual step of exercising its subpoena authority July 27.

posted 07-29-2011 08:34 AM               

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Originally posted by issman1:
...go with SpaceX's Falcon Heavy.

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posted 07-29-2011 09:03 AM               

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Originally posted by Fra Mauro:
It doesn't look good when Congress has to subpoena info on the HLV.

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NASA spokesman Mike Cabbage responded to the news of the subpoena.

“While we share the Senators' commitment to human space exploration and implementation of the Authorization Act, we also have a commitment to be responsible stewards of taxpayer dollars. The Space Launch System is the most important — and expensive — decision NASA will make for the next decade, and we want to get it right so we don't repeat the mistakes of the past or get pushed into making a premature decision about our nation's deep space exploration plans."

posted 07-29-2011 09:39 AM               

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Originally posted by issman1:
From my understanding, two Falcon Heavy's could carry anything that SLS could (may be even better).

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posted 07-29-2011 09:42 AM               

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Originally posted by Fra Mauro:
...a "bone" should have been thrown to them

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posted 07-29-2011 11:18 AM            

Regarding the ridiculous partisan debt deal shenanigans going on, do American politicians look good right now? NO!

In this climate maybe somebody at NASA calculated okay, let them subpoena us: at this point it is not possible for us to look worse than our bosses.

posted 07-29-2011 03:23 PM               

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Originally posted by issman1:
I think SpaceX is being quite modest about its heavy-lifter.

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Some really smart people think that the promises of the commercial guys are greatly over-optimistic. Others here appear to think that we should just chain the doors at NASA and push the old codger out to pasture. The right answer is realistically someplace in between. The challenge is finding that middle ground.

posted 07-30-2011 01:47 AM               

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Originally posted by 328KF:
One thing is for certain, we as a nation should not repeat the mistakes of the past and allow ourselves to put all of our eggs in one basket, commercial or gov't developed, again.

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posted 07-30-2011 03:40 AM            

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Originally posted by 328KF:
...they suffer from an abundance of overconfidence and brashness.

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It sounds more reminiscent of the can-do days of NASA than anything else.

posted 08-22-2011 09:38 AM               

Dr. Scott Pace, director of the Space Policy Institute at George Washington University, raised the Ares option last week as one way out of political and financial thicket that has enmeshed the Space Launch System (SLS), which is the formal name for the heavy-lift rocket project...

"You build on the work that was already done," Pace said of Ares I. "You can fly the MPCV. You have five-segment solid (rocket motors) that are already done. You have a use then on the upper stage for the J-2X engine, which is also in development."

Ares I would also "provide a backup option in case the commercial crew guys run into problems," Pace said. "And it's a foundation to be able to return to the moon with the international partners at some point."

posted 08-23-2011 09:28 PM               

In general, the estimates prepared by SLS, MPCV, and 21CGS are consistent with Analysis of Alternative (AoA) level estimates and are reasonable point estimates for budget planning in the near-term 3-5 year budget horizon. They are serviceable in that they represent the basis to build upon for future life-cycle cost estimates of the quality required for long-term budget formulation and the development of program baselines.

None of the estimates reviewed by the ICA Team support establishment of long-term budgets or detailed baselines consistent with NPR 7120.5 requirements. They are, however, reasonable AoA estimates appropriate for supporting trade studies and comparative analyses.

All three Program estimates assume large, unsubstantiated, future cost efficiencies leading to the impression that they are optimistic. A scenario-based risk assessment, which excludes cost estimating uncertainty and unknown-unknown risks (historically major sources of cost and schedule growth), reveals all three Programs' reserves are insufficient.

posted 09-14-2011 08:16 AM               

NASA Announces Major Decisions For Future Human Spaceflight

NASA leaders will participate in two media events Wednesday, Sept. 14, to discuss the new Space Launch System that will take American astronauts farther into space than ever before.

At 10:00 a.m. EDT, NASA Administrator Charles Bolden will join members of Congress, including Sens. Kay Bailey Hutchison and Bill Nelson, for a news conference in SDG-50 on the ground floor of the Senate Dirksen Building in Washington.

The event will be webcast live on the Senate Commerce Committee's website and on NASA TV.

At 12 p.m. NASA will hold a background media teleconference with William Gerstenmaier, associate administrator for NASA's Human Exploration and Operations (HEO) Mission Directorate, Doug Cooke, deputy associate administrator for HEO, NASA Chief Financial Officer Beth Robinson and other senior managers.

Audio of the teleconference will be streamed live.

posted 09-14-2011 09:16 AM               

NASA Announces Design for New Deep Space Exploration System

NASA is ready to move forward with the development of the Space Launch System — an advanced heavy-lift launch vehicle that will provide an entirely new national capability for human exploration beyond Earth's orbit. The Space Launch System will give the nation a safe, affordable and sustainable means of reaching beyond our current limits and opening up new discoveries from the unique vantage point of space... [continue reading]

posted 09-14-2011 10:29 AM               

And while SLS's side-mounted boosters will may start off as space shuttle solid rocket motors during development flights, their ultimate design will be competed and could end up being liquid-fueled rockets.

As an aside, Sen. Bill Nelson noted during the press conference this morning that the images released so far are of the "smaller" 70 metric ton (mT) version.

posted 09-14-2011 11:12 AM               

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Originally posted by issman1:
It should be a liquid-fueled system from the outset

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"It's initially solid rocket motors for potentially the first or second test flights and then we'll go compete those boosters and they could be any type of propellant," he said.

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At least that awfully big launch tower at KSC will be used

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