Space News
space history and artifacts articles

Messages
space history discussion forums

Sightings
worldwide astronaut appearances

Resources
selected space history documents

Websites
related space history websites

  collectSPACE: Messages
  Exploration: Asteroids, Moon and Mars
  Neil A. Armstrong Lunar Outpost

Post New Topic  Post A Reply
profile | register | preferences | faq | search

next newest topic | next oldest topic
Author Topic:   Neil A. Armstrong Lunar Outpost
Robert Pearlman
Editor

Posts: 27328
From: Houston, TX
Registered: Nov 1999

posted 05-21-2008 03:50 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Robert Pearlman   Click Here to Email Robert Pearlman     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
The National Aeronautics and Space Administration Authorization Act of 2008 (HR 6063), which cleared the House of Representatives Committee on Science and Technology's Subcommittee on Space and Aeronautics on May 20, includes the following:
Sec. 403. Lunar Outpost.
  1. Establishment- As NASA works toward the establishment of a lunar outpost, NASA shall make no plans that would require a lunar outpost to be occupied to maintain its viability. Any such outpost shall be operable as a human-tended facility capable of remote or autonomous operation for extended periods.

  2. Designation- The United States portion of the first human-tended outpost established on the surface of the Moon shall be designated the 'Neil A. Armstrong Lunar Outpost'.

  3. Congressional Intent- It is the intent of Congress that NASA shall make use of commercial services to the maximum extent practicable in support of its lunar outpost activities.
(Of course, this has to be approved by the full committee, the full House and then the Senate before it can become law.)

Rodina
New Member

Posts:
From:
Registered:

posted 05-21-2008 11:15 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Rodina   Click Here to Email Rodina     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Sigh. Can't we wait until people are dead to name stuff after them?

Space Emblem Art
Member

Posts: 164
From: Citrus Heights, CA - USA
Registered: Jan 2006

posted 05-21-2008 11:27 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Space Emblem Art   Click Here to Email Space Emblem Art     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I wonder what Neil Armstrong thinks about this?

Some years ago I wrote some articles (unpublished) about a speculative future of U.S. human space flight including returning to the moon, missions to Mars, and space tourism. The return to the moon included establishment of permanent lunar bases under an acronym called "OASIS" (Observation and Scientific Investigation Stations) the first of which I called OASIS Armstrong. With the article were a series of space emblems I designed for these future flights.

Another case of life imitating art?

Robert Pearlman
Editor

Posts: 27328
From: Houston, TX
Registered: Nov 1999

posted 05-21-2008 11:41 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Robert Pearlman   Click Here to Email Robert Pearlman     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Space Emblem Art:
Another case of life imitating art?
My friend and colleague Tariq Malik at SPACE.com pointed out another "life-after-art" nod in this case:
Or NASA could take a page from the science fiction film "Star Trek: First Contact" and call it Lake Armstrong, though of course they'd have to build the lake indoors.
Zefram Cochrane: You don't have a moon in the 24th century?

William Riker: Sure we do. Just looks a lot different. There are 50 million people living on the moon in my time. You can see Tycho City, New Berlin... even Lake Armstrong on a day like this.

Lunar rock nut
Member

Posts: 680
From: Oklahoma city, Oklahoma U.S.A.
Registered: Feb 2007

posted 05-22-2008 06:33 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Lunar rock nut   Click Here to Email Lunar rock nut     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Buzz gets left out in the cold again.

keith.wilson
Member

Posts: 62
From: Callander, Stirling, Scotland
Registered: Jun 2002

posted 05-22-2008 07:42 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for keith.wilson     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Don't you have to ask permission to use a name in this way if the person is still alive? Perhaps Neil gave his approval!

jimsz
Member

Posts: 530
From:
Registered: Aug 2006

posted 05-22-2008 09:00 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for jimsz     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Rodina:
Sigh. Can't we wait until people are dead to name stuff after them?

Unfortunately, since this is decades away many of us probably won't be here!

music_space
Member

Posts: 1050
From: Canada
Registered: Jul 2001

posted 05-22-2008 01:29 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for music_space   Click Here to Email music_space     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I'm against this. One of the values of space exploration which appeals to me is the "We" factor, the team effort, the national or international collective project. They were two in that LM, three atop that Saturn V, and hundreds of thousands involved.

sts205cdr
Member

Posts: 534
From: Sacramento, CA
Registered: Jun 2001

posted 05-22-2008 02:01 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for sts205cdr   Click Here to Email sts205cdr     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Something like "Armalcol Station" would be a better name, in my opinion.

LCDR Scott Schneeweis
New Member

Posts:
From:
Registered:

posted 05-22-2008 03:48 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for LCDR Scott Schneeweis   Click Here to Email LCDR Scott Schneeweis     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Once commercial interests get involved its only a matter of time before Armstrong Station will be renamed Exxon Mobile or Citigroup Station.

capoetc
Member

Posts: 1705
From: Newnan GA (USA)
Registered: Aug 2005

posted 05-22-2008 06:07 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for capoetc   Click Here to Email capoetc     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by LCDR Scott Schneeweis:
Once commercial interests get involved its only a matter of time before Armstrong Station will be renamed Exxon Mobile or Citigroup Station
No, it will be the Neil A. Armstrong Lunar Outpost, presented by Exxon-Mobil ...

Dave Clow
Member

Posts: 213
From: South Pasadena, CA 91030
Registered: Nov 2003

posted 05-23-2008 03:46 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Dave Clow   Click Here to Email Dave Clow     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I can't imagine Armstrong feeling good about this. There weren't any names on the mission patch. He talks about the team and the program but not himself. Maybe Tranquillity Base II would be suitable. (Or with a nod to Charlie Duke, call it Twan-quillity Base.)

Robert Pearlman
Editor

Posts: 27328
From: Houston, TX
Registered: Nov 1999

posted 06-05-2008 07:16 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Robert Pearlman   Click Here to Email Robert Pearlman     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Robert Pearlman:
Of course, this has to be approved by the full committee...
Committee Approves NASA Authorization Act
Today [June 4], the House Science and Technology Committee unanimously passed legislation to reauthorize NASA, H.R. 6063, the National Aeronautics and Space Administration Authorization Act of 2008.

Jay Chladek
Member

Posts: 2211
From: Bellevue, NE, USA
Registered: Aug 2007

posted 06-08-2008 07:21 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Jay Chladek   Click Here to Email Jay Chladek     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Well, look at the bright side in terms of life imitating art, at least they didn't call it "Moonbase Alpha".

Robert Pearlman
Editor

Posts: 27328
From: Houston, TX
Registered: Nov 1999

posted 09-27-2008 06:41 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Robert Pearlman   Click Here to Email Robert Pearlman     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
From a House of Representatives release:
With unanimous support, the House of Representatives today passed H.R. 6063, the National Aeronautics and Space Administration Authorization Act of 2008, authorizing programs at NASA for fiscal year 2009 (FY09). H.R. 6063 initially passed the House on June 18, 2008 by a vote of 409 to 15 and was brought back to the House today, after passing the Senate with minor modifications. The bill will now be sent to the White House for the President's approval.
The version passed by both the Senate and House includes the provision for the "Neil A. Armstrong Lunar Outpost".

Apollo Redux
Member

Posts: 346
From: Montreal, Quebec, Canada
Registered: Sep 2006

posted 10-05-2008 12:55 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Apollo Redux   Click Here to Email Apollo Redux     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Rodina:
Sigh. Can't we wait until people are dead to name stuff after them?

Here, here!

Delta7
Member

Posts: 1153
From: Ossian IN USA
Registered: Oct 2007

posted 10-05-2008 10:30 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Delta7   Click Here to Email Delta7     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Rodina:
Sigh. Can't we wait until people are dead to name stuff after them?

Why? Although I'm pretty sure Neil Armstrong would agree with you, it's kind of like sending flowers to a funeral. The deceased really can't appreciate them at that point!

Personally, I think the Mike Fincke Lunar Mining Station has a great ring to it!

Apollo Redux
Member

Posts: 346
From: Montreal, Quebec, Canada
Registered: Sep 2006

posted 10-07-2008 09:06 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Apollo Redux   Click Here to Email Apollo Redux     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
The naming of a monument, ship, school, etc., is not for the purpose of rewarding the namesake while alive. It's purpose is to signify their passing, and to remind those they leave behind and future generations, the significant and/or historic contribution(s)they have made.

To name name things left, right, and center while people are alive, would invoke needless emotions and political pandering, to say nothing of dilluting the intent - Paying respectful homage in a manner that reflects how they lived.

Robert Pearlman
Editor

Posts: 27328
From: Houston, TX
Registered: Nov 1999

posted 10-26-2008 08:34 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Robert Pearlman   Click Here to Email Robert Pearlman     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
During a recent opportunity I had to chat with Neil Armstrong, I asked him if he was aware of the legislation that would name the U.S. segment of the lunar outpost after him.

Not only had he not heard that the bill was recently signed into law, but he was not even aware that the legislation existed.

I wonder when the authors of the Act planned to inform him?

mjanovec
Member

Posts: 3593
From: Midwest, USA
Registered: Jul 2005

posted 10-27-2008 11:52 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for mjanovec   Click Here to Email mjanovec     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Apollo Redux:
The naming of a monument, ship, school, etc., is not for the purpose of rewarding the namesake while alive. It's purpose is to signify their passing

While that is often the case, there are numerous instances where things are named in honor of living individuals. John Young has a freeway named after him in Florida. John Glenn has a research center named after him (and likely many other things). And, indeed, Neil Armstrong has countless schools named him. It seemed to be in fashion to name schools after him in the late 60s and early 70s. (Just do a Google search for "Neil Armstrong school" sometime.)

There are some honors, however, that do require you to be dead in order to receive them. For example, your likeness cannot be issued on a US postage stamp unless you are deceased.

FFrench
Member

Posts: 3093
From: San Diego
Registered: Feb 2002

posted 10-27-2008 12:17 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for FFrench     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by mjanovec:
There are some honors, however, that do require you to be dead in order to receive them. For example, your likeness cannot be issued on a US postage stamp unless you are deceased.
While that used to be the case, and is probably still the general rule, I am not sure it is absolute anymore. While they were symbolic representatives of a wider stamp design meaning, this stamp shows three real firefighters who, as the White House photo shows, were included in the stamp unveiling ceremonies and whose faces are clearly visible in the stamp.

Robert Pearlman
Editor

Posts: 27328
From: Houston, TX
Registered: Nov 1999

posted 10-27-2008 01:39 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Robert Pearlman   Click Here to Email Robert Pearlman     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by FFrench:
While that used to be the case, and is probably still the general rule, I am not sure it is absolute anymore.
The rule, which is still enforced, reads:
No living person shall be honored by portrayal on U.S. postage.
I think the key distinction is "honored"; while the firefighters depicted were living, the stamp was not issued in their specific honor.

Mr Meek
Member

Posts: 348
From: Chattanooga, TN
Registered: Dec 2007

posted 10-27-2008 02:37 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Mr Meek     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
While we can (and should) debate and discuss the suitability of the name or Armstrong's feelings on the subject, I think we're missing something else worth noting. Robert not only got a chance to talk to Neil Armstrong, he was the first one to tell him that there will be a moon base named in his honor.

Neat.

Moonwalker1954
Member

Posts: 236
From: Montreal, Canada
Registered: Jul 2004

posted 10-27-2008 09:21 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Moonwalker1954   Click Here to Email Moonwalker1954     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I thought that Neil Armstrong was a long time cS reader!

FFrench
Member

Posts: 3093
From: San Diego
Registered: Feb 2002

posted 10-27-2008 09:37 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for FFrench     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Robert Pearlman:
I think the key distinction is "honored"; while the firefighters depicted were living, the stamp was not issued in their specific honor.
That makes a certain amount of sense - interesting, thanks.

Although the meaning of "honoring" is open to interpretation. When they are invited to the White House for the stamp unveiling and a photoshoot with the President, it's hard not to say there is some element of individual "honoring" going on... even if they were symbolic of their wider colleagues...

Robert Pearlman
Editor

Posts: 27328
From: Houston, TX
Registered: Nov 1999

posted 10-28-2008 10:14 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Robert Pearlman   Click Here to Email Robert Pearlman     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I think the point is that the stamp wasn't called the "William Eisengrein, George Johnson and Daniel McWilliams stamp" but rather the "Heroes of 2001" stamp.

As another example, the crew of Apollo 11 was present at the dedication ceremony for the 1969 First Man On The Moon stamp, and though it includes an illustration of Neil Armstrong stepping off the ladder, it was not issued in honor of the men (or man) but rather that moment in history.

FFrench
Member

Posts: 3093
From: San Diego
Registered: Feb 2002

posted 10-28-2008 11:38 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for FFrench     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Indeed, I think we are pretty much in heated agreement here. The Return To Space stamp, as shown in your linked story called "John Glenn honored with postage stamp" showing Shuttle discovery and Friendship 7 was to honor Glenn's two flights, but in a way that did not show his face.

All times are CT (US)

next newest topic | next oldest topic

Administrative Options: Close Topic | Archive/Move | Delete Topic
Post New Topic  Post A Reply
Hop to:

Contact Us | The Source for Space History & Artifacts

Copyright 1999-2012 collectSPACE.com All rights reserved.


Ultimate Bulletin Board 5.47a





advertisement