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Topic: Aurora Auctions April '07 Auction
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connoisseur
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posted 04-06-2007 10:35 PM
   
I don't have the Aurora 2003 catalog in front of me at the moment BUT, if memory serves me correctly, the Slayton cable was mounted on a presentation plaque with descriptive plaque. As I have handled/described both that item and most other Slayton memorabilia to come on the market over the years, I can stated unqualifiedly that the piece was exactly as described AND was sold in the sale (all Slayton memorabilia is sold without reserve).I will be glad to answer any questions as to this or other Slayton memorabilia. |
ArtandAstro
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posted 04-07-2007 05:46 AM
quote:
Originally posted by space1:
SRB is right; the camera handle is item 1028 on the stowage list.
I stand corrected. Sorry, but I mixed the handle up with the trigger. Still the question remains, was this handle used during the EVAs or is it the spare one.Dirt on an Apollo related artifact doesn't mean in each case "lunar dust" It is really a pity that nobody knows for what most of the artifacts from Mr Scott's collection really were used for. I'm wondering why Aurora is not participating in this discussion. |
cddfspace
Member Posts: 609
From: Morris County, NJ, USA
Registered: Jan 2006
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posted 04-07-2007 08:21 AM
Any thoughts on Lot number 443 (Ed White) or Lot number 236 (Gus Grissom)? |
mjanovec
Member Posts: 3811
From: Midwest, USA
Registered: Jul 2005
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posted 04-07-2007 11:43 AM
quote:
Originally posted by cddfspace:
Any thoughts on Lot number 443 (Ed White) or Lot number 236 (Gus Grissom)?
My thoughts are that it sure would be nice to have larger images of these autographs that are often targeted by forgers. Surely larger images could be posted at the Ebay live site, if nothing else...but I checked there and they are still tiny. It's simply not enough to convince me to part with my money (plus a 20% commission), especially since the forgery ratio appears to be no better than regular Ebay auctions.
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aeroman
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posted 04-09-2007 04:50 AM
With reference to the PLSS cable, I was surprised to find the catalogue photo clearly pointing to the same cable as the one sold at an earlier auction. Is this confusion related to Florian's wonderful Scott presentation, which I assume is the original PLSS cable ? |
taneal1
Member Posts: 230
From: Orlando, FL
Registered: Feb 2004
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posted 04-10-2007 04:45 PM
Anyone care to offer opinions regarding the following lots: 299 (G&Y GT-3 cover)
304 Ed White signed photo
459 A8 CP Thanks to all who offer opinions! |
mjanovec
Member Posts: 3811
From: Midwest, USA
Registered: Jul 2005
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posted 04-10-2007 05:10 PM
quote:
Originally posted by taneal1:
Anyone care to offer opinions regarding the following lots: 304 Ed White signed photo
459 A8 CP
The photos for these lots are too small to tell. There is nothing about 304 that screams out being an obvious fake, but its still to hard to tell with the few pixels that show the signature. I'll be damned if I can even see the Anders signature in 459...but it's said to be in silver ink, so that might be why. The Lovell and Borman signatures here look OK at first glance, but I wouldn't use those two signatures as an endorsement for the authenticity of an Anders signature we can't see. |
Ken Havekotte
Member Posts: 2915
From: Merritt Island, Florida, Brevard
Registered: Mar 2001
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posted 04-10-2007 07:00 PM
Just noticed an earlier post from Scott Sch. about the cover page of Aurora's current space auction. Scott is correct; Lot #224 depicting a Rocketdyne engine contractor model isn't at all related to the NASA Project Mercury program. The picture on the cover page is indeed a liquid-propulsion rocket engine from an early Thor IRBM. It looks to be a MB-3 model of a XLR70/NA-9 production engine that did develop about 150,000 lbs. of liftoff thrust. Once again, as Scott already made alert to, this rocket engine model was not related to Mercury in anyway. |
machbusterman
Member Posts: 1778
From: Dunfermline, Fife, Scotland
Registered: May 2004
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posted 04-11-2007 02:32 AM
Three days before the auction and no catalogue yet. Seriously, I wonder what's the point in producing and sending these things out to time them to arrive either just after or just before the auction? If one is a serious collector one needs time to REALLY digest the items in the catalogue.Perhaps something to consider (for all auction houses) rather than sending out a heavy/bulky catalogue would be to put the catalogue itself onto CD. A CD costs a few pence to produce & costs much less to ship. An added bonus would also be that the CD could allow for higher quality scans/pictures of the items? |
mjanovec
Member Posts: 3811
From: Midwest, USA
Registered: Jul 2005
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posted 04-11-2007 02:55 AM
quote:
Originally posted by machbusterman:
Perhaps something to consider (for all auction houses) rather than sending out a heavy/bulky catalogue would be to put the catalogue itself onto CD. A CD costs a few pence to produce & costs much less to ship. An added bonus would also be that the CD could allow for higher quality scans/pictures of the items?
This is a great idea! I wish auction houses would consider this...hi-res scans would really help the collector determine what to bid on. |
freshspot
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posted 04-11-2007 04:13 AM
My catalog arrived in the mail two days ago (Boston, MA). |
connoisseur
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posted 04-11-2007 05:47 AM
quote:
Originally posted by mjanovec:
This is a great idea! I wish auction houses would consider this... hi-res scans would really help the collector determine what to bid on.
This is a GREAT idea as we are pulling out hair out (not that I have much left), mainly how to get the catalog to Europe and Asia in a timely manner. If those of you on cS who would like an copy of the catalog electronically please let us know, we will be glad look into sending it to you via CD rather than print. The more that indicate an interest, the more likely we will be able to set up a new catalog stream. It will all depend on volume as it would mean setting up a new internal catalog stream and handling proceedures. Is there a foremat that could be used whereby it could be speedily downloaded to disc from the web site? You can tell I am semi-illiterate regarding cutting edge computer techniques so I have to ask the question. That would simplify things even more. |
VCampbell
Member Posts: 83
From: Bell Canyon CA USA
Registered: Oct 2002
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posted 04-11-2007 06:40 AM
quote:
Originally posted by machbusterman:
Perhaps something to consider (for all auction houses) rather than sending out a heavy/bulky catalogue would be to put the catalogue itself onto CD. A CD costs a few pence to produce & costs much less to ship. An added bonus would also be that the CD could allow for higher quality scans/pictures of the items?
Derek - we are already sending catalogs via CD to customers who have requested this format about a year ago (there was a similar post by one customer on cS and at that time I asked that anyone who wished a catalog on CD email me - those who did now receive their catalogs via CD).Separately, eBay has put a serious restriction on the size of scans, which severely limits the size of pictures we can load. If anyone wants a high res scan for a particular lot, please contact us through our regular email(as numerous customers have already done for this auction!!) and we will email the high res photos back to you. |
Richard
New Member Posts: 5
From: Morrisonville, New York USA
Registered: Apr 2009
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posted 04-11-2007 07:26 AM
This seems like a good idea. However, in the end this would create a large volume of high resolution authentic signatures floating around. In light of the recent photoshop Armstrong forgery, would this be wise? (In that Scott was able to trace the signature back to the source by the ownership of the original signature. Tracing the forgery of such a photoshopped item could then become impossible.) |
JasonIUP
Member Posts: 282
From: PA
Registered: Apr 2004
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posted 04-11-2007 08:42 AM
So, to ensure that no one can lift a scan, maybe there should be NO pictures! Not well thought out.... |
Scott
Member Posts: 3307
From: Houston, TX
Registered: May 2001
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posted 04-11-2007 09:57 AM
quote:
Originally posted by Richard:
This seems like a good idea. However, in the end this would create a large volume of high resolution authentic signatures floating around. In light of the recent photoshop Armstrong forgery, would this be wise? (In that Scott was able to trace the signature back to the source by the ownership of the original signature. Tracing the forgery of such a photoshopped item could then become impossible.)
Richard, I see your point about the dangers of a lot of high resolution image CDs going around. Somewhat larger images (than presently done) in catalogs or CDs with moderate resolution scans would be a good remedy in my opinion.Regarding the authentic Armstrong signature (on the insurance cover) used for the stamp block fraud, we must remember that ownership of the insurance cover would at most be a piece of the puzzle (as Matt pointed out, someone may have obtained a high resolution scan of that insurance cover in the past from one of its owners - which by the way, if that occurred, would demontrate your argument) - it is the ownership history of the forged stamp block itself which is key and which will lead directly back to the forger. |
ArtandAstro
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posted 04-11-2007 10:52 AM
To Victoria Campbell, CEO Aurora:Do you have any comments in regard to the Apollo 15 flown PLSS cable(s)? |
gliderpilotuk
Member Posts: 3398
From: London, UK
Registered: Feb 2002
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posted 04-11-2007 11:48 AM
quote:
Originally posted by Richard:
This seems like a good idea. However, in the end this would create a large volume of high resolution authentic signatures floating around. In light of the recent photoshop Armstrong forgery, would this be wise? (In that Scott was able to trace the signature back to the source by the ownership of the original signature. Tracing the forgery of such a photoshopped item could then become impossible.)
I was one of those who proposed the CD idea to Aurora after receiving another auction on CD with superb zoom and pan features. Personally I'd rather see an accurate image of what I'm bidding on and a CD facilitates this. The images can be PDF'd to prevent copying and a forger has plenty of other sources anyway....like buying an original and copying it!
It also saves paper, freight and CO2 emissions! |
mjanovec
Member Posts: 3811
From: Midwest, USA
Registered: Jul 2005
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posted 04-11-2007 11:49 AM
quote:
Originally posted by Richard:
This seems like a good idea. However, in the end this would create a large volume of high resolution authentic signatures floating around. In light of the recent photoshop Armstrong forgery, would this be wise?
Perhaps I should have said medium-resolution scans. I certainly wouldn't expect scans to be presented is such hi-res format that they would help the scammers. But they should be large enough for the average collector to be able to clearly see the signature and determine it's authenticity to the best of their ability (considering limitations of scans). |
apollo11lem5
Member Posts: 528
From: Seminole, Florida, United States
Registered: May 2000
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posted 04-11-2007 07:46 PM
A question on Lots #652 and #653 as both are Apollo 15 signed beta cloth patches. The signatures appear to be very similar if not identical. are they in fact autopens? In the catalog they appear to be identical? Am I wrong? Addendum: I have been informed by Victoria Campbell that these items are from Dave Scott's collection are in fact NOT AP'S. Many thanks to Victoria and the help from the great staff at Aurora!! |
p.kentzinger
Member Posts: 95
From: Kienheim, France
Registered: Mar 2002
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posted 04-13-2007 12:15 PM
Catalogue arrived today to France. It was time.  |
JasonIUP
Member Posts: 282
From: PA
Registered: Apr 2004
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posted 04-13-2007 01:17 PM
Can one leave maximum bids today with Aurora directly rather than bidding on eBay tomorrow? |
LCDR Scott Schneeweis
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posted 04-13-2007 02:19 PM
quote:
Originally posted by ArtandAstro:
Do you have any comments in regard to the Apollo 15 flown PLSS cable(s)?
Perplexing Aurora has chosen not to respond (at least via this Forum) to any of the issues raised...the auctions in question appear to remain unmodified/active... |
Peter Kemp
Member Posts: 91
From: Chelmsford, Essex, United Kingdom
Registered: Jul 2002
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posted 04-13-2007 02:22 PM
My catalogue delivered to me here in the UK this afternoon after an abortive attempt by DHL yesterday. Just in time for tomorrow. Its the second time that its been delivered with the packet torn open and damaged. It actually said "Re-packaged by DHL" so what happened to the original shipping envelope is anybody's guess. I believe DHL were charging Aurora something approaching $60 to ship a catalogue to the UK but that sort of money doesn't seem to guaranee your item will arrive in one piece. |
Steve Shaffer
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posted 04-13-2007 03:38 PM
Agree with Scott Schneeweis that it is extremely disappointing that Aurora has not responded to authoritative comments made here about several of its items--most particularly the Apollo 15 flown PLSS cable(s). Serious issues raised and apparently ignored. |
gliderpilotuk
Member Posts: 3398
From: London, UK
Registered: Feb 2002
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posted 04-13-2007 05:08 PM
CD catalogue arrived to day. |
Novaspace
Member Posts: 434
From: Tucson, AZ USA
Registered: Sep 2004
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posted 04-14-2007 02:36 PM
Lot #692 is not an original painting, but a color xerox. A man in Canada owns the original, which is 15x20. |
BuddyBoy
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posted 04-14-2007 07:14 PM
quote:
Originally posted by Novaspace:
Lot #692 is not an original painting, but a color xerox. A man in Canada owns the original, which is 15x20.
If this is accurate, you know, the more I see stuff like this the more convinced I am that I need to stay far far away from anything in the "David Scott Collection." From the number of things he's "brought back from the moon", the man must have had saddlebags on his space suit.
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Richard
New Member Posts: 5
From: Morrisonville, New York USA
Registered: Apr 2009
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posted 04-14-2007 10:45 PM
I believe that the astronauts tried to bring as many momentos back as possible. However, like it or not, there are still not many artifacts USED on the lunar surface available. |
divemaster
Member Posts: 1376
From: ridgefield, ct
Registered: May 2002
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posted 04-14-2007 11:33 PM
Wasn't lot 692 withdrawn and/or a no lot? |
Robert Pearlman
Editor Posts: 42988
From: Houston, TX
Registered: Nov 1999
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posted 04-14-2007 11:41 PM
According to eBay's results, lot 692: Apollo 15 Butler Painting Apollo 15 Hadley Rille sold for $300 to a bidder on the floor, after an $80 proxy bid was placed by someone on the internet. If the lot had been withdrawn, would either bid be shown?On edit: By comparison, lots 4 and 5, while in the catalog, appear to be missing from eBay's closed auction results. |
Rick Mulheirn
Member Posts: 4167
From: England
Registered: Feb 2001
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posted 04-15-2007 06:04 AM
Even with my limited knowledge of Armstrong signed items I was both surprised and worried that several forgeries, which bidders subsequently bid good money for, were not withdrawn. |
farthestreaches
Member Posts: 1075
From: Redondo Beach, Ca
Registered: Jan 2001
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posted 04-15-2007 09:13 AM
quote:
Originally posted by Robert Pearlman:
According to eBay's results, lot 692: Apollo 15 Butler Painting Apollo 15 Hadley Rille sold for $300 to a bidder on the floor, after an $80 proxy bid was placed by someone on the internet. If the lot had been withdrawn, would either bid be shown?On edit: By comparison, lots 4 and 5, while in the catalog, appear to be missing from eBay's closed auction results.
Not in a position to speak as to how ebay partipants experienced the "Butler Painting" BUT being on the auction floor, can say that when this item came up it was immediately described as a "No Lot" and passed over. I also checked my catalog after reading this post and see that I had actually "X'd" through that item. |
BuddyBoy
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posted 04-15-2007 02:54 PM
quote:
Originally posted by Richard:
I believe that the astronauts tried to bring as many momentos back as possible. However, like it or not, there are still not many artifacts USED on the lunar surface available.
I agree, but I seem to recall something about the Apollo 15 crew forgetting their PPKs in the jettisoned LEM, but then saying that the signed and cancelled stamp covers that they "brought back" were actually kept in the pockets of their space suits.Can anyone confirm that or is it just a rumor I've misinterpreted?
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BuddyBoy
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posted 04-15-2007 02:57 PM
quote:
Originally posted by Rick Mulheirn:
Even with my limited knowledge of Armstrong signed items I was both surprised and worried that several forgeries, which bidders subsequently bid good money for, were not withdrawn.
What gave it away, but was also kind of sad, was that these item received absolutely no floor bids or action and were sold to internet bidders only - usually with only a few, though high, bids. |
cosmos-walter
Member Posts: 691
From: Salzburg, Austria
Registered: Jun 2003
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posted 04-15-2007 03:00 PM
Now auction is almost over. Probably I am not the only one still waiting for catalogue. I am sad that obviously nobody cares the many faked "flown" Soviet/Russian flags and covers that are offered also in this Aurora auction. |
Robert Pearlman
Editor Posts: 42988
From: Houston, TX
Registered: Nov 1999
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posted 04-15-2007 03:03 PM
quote:
Originally posted by BuddyBoy:
Can anyone confirm that or is it just a rumor I've misinterpreted?
See: Apollo 15 flown covers, souvenirs and the "third PPK" for discussion of the Apollo 15 covers and the disposition of the PPKs on-board. |
benguttery
Member Posts: 547
From: Fort Worth, TX, USA
Registered: Feb 2005
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posted 04-15-2007 09:37 PM
Was it my imagination or were prices a bit softer? |
H E Pennypacker
Member Posts: 53
From: Sydney, NSW, Australia
Registered: Dec 2004
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posted 04-15-2007 11:46 PM
quote:
Even with my limited knowledge of Armstrong signed items I was both surprised and worried that several forgeries, which bidders subsequently bid good money for, were not withdrawn.
Which act is worse - forging a signature for profit, or knowingly selling a forgery for profit? Both as bad as each other aren't they? Ebayers selling forgeries are shot down here (as they should be), but apart from a few concerned voices like Rick's, the silence over this auction house's behaviour is deafening...
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BuddyBoy
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posted 04-15-2007 11:59 PM
quote:
Originally posted by benguttery:
Was it my imagination or were prices a bit softer?
It felt that way to me. I've paid premium prices before for just generic old space books, etc, but this time I picked up a ton at $10 per item. Bless the floor bidder who kept bidding $5 to drop item's below their eBay opening price, but who wasn't interested in going to $20! 
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