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  310081937310: Apollo 17 insurance cover?

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Author Topic:   310081937310: Apollo 17 insurance cover?
Michael
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Posts: 309
From: Brooklyn New York
Registered: Jun 2002

posted 09-15-2008 02:52 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Michael   Click Here to Email Michael     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Is this a real insurance cover for Apollo 17? I didn't think there was an Insurance Cover on the Apollo 17 mission.

capoetc
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Posts: 1814
From: Newnan GA (USA)
Registered: Aug 2005

posted 09-15-2008 03:27 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for capoetc   Click Here to Email capoetc     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I saw that one too. I'll be interested to hear what others say, particularly because Evans annotated the timing of the signatures being before the mission. Too bad it wasn't canceled for the launch or moon landing.

Perhaps the question is, what was the crew members' intent? Did they sign these before the mission to be used as insurance for their families? Or did they sign them because they had spare time in crew quarters? Or some other reason?

It is an interesting piece, nonetheless, because of the Evans inscription on the back.

SpaceAholic
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Posts: 3339
From: Sierra Vista, Arizona
Registered: Nov 1999

posted 09-15-2008 04:11 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for SpaceAholic   Click Here to Email SpaceAholic     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
A while back during a book signing, I specifically queried Capt. Cernan about this issue... his reply (its been almost 10 years so I don't recall his exact words) was that yes, there were Apollo 17 insurance cover analogs and that he would in the future make them available for sale...

Ken Havekotte
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Posts: 2082
From: Merritt Island, Florida, Brevard
Registered: Mar 2001

posted 09-15-2008 06:34 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Ken Havekotte   Click Here to Email Ken Havekotte     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
It has always been my understanding that such a term, "crew insurance policy covers," were not defined by any Apollo 17 crew members for a number of reasons.

Yes, I know for fact, the crew did use/sign many of the MSCSC and NASA Exchange mission cachet covers before and after their final lunar voyage launch in 1972.

There were even no special Bishop astronaut crew-insignia covers produced for Apollo 17 mainly because of the big cover-stamp-astronaut signings, and other commercial-controversial issues that NASA had been highly exposed to all throughout that same year.

We'll have to wait and see what Cernan comes up with, huh?

spaceflori
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Posts: 1422
From: Germany
Registered: May 2000

posted 09-16-2008 12:04 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for spaceflori   Click Here to Email spaceflori     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Novaspace has sold several covers from Cernan that were canceled in 1992 for the 20th anniversary then which are claimed to be sort of insurance covers - are these the ones he was possibly talking about 10 years ago?

I have received information for Sieger that Jim Irwin did in fact declare similar covers like Al Worden is selling as insurance covers (those Type II covers) already in the early 70s.

So I guess there are more "insurance covers" out there than we probably know.

Question is if you only consider those with the astronaut wings printed on as real insurance covers or any other cover that was signed before the launch.

Technically an insurance cover has to be one that was in the astronaut's family possession throughout the flight, that's what counts.

capoetc
Member

Posts: 1814
From: Newnan GA (USA)
Registered: Aug 2005

posted 09-16-2008 05:04 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for capoetc   Click Here to Email capoetc     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by spaceflori:
So I guess there are more "insurance covers" out there than we probably know.
I'm pretty sure there were three types of Apollo 11 insurance covers (MSC stamp club, Dow Unicover, and crew patch), and none of them had astronaut wings printed on them.

I agree regarding the concept that the covers had to be in the possession of the family during the mission (or at least, accessible by them during this time). This would show the intent for the crew to use them as life insurance.

Apparently, on Apollo 11, Tom Stafford had possession of the covers when the crew launched. He arranged for some of them to be canceled on launch day at KSC and then carried all of them in his T-38 back to Houston. He then arranged for the remainder to be canceled in Houston on the day of the moon landing (apparently, the canceling machine at the Houston post office was going haywire that day, as many of the covers have really ugly cancellations). The covers were then distributed to the three families, although I am not sure if they actually received the covers before the mission was completed.

Anyway, the winning bidder paid $417 for the Apollo 17 cover. Is it an insurance cover? I don't know, but I guess if someone wants a complete insurance cover collection, its probably the closest thing...

spaceflori
Member

Posts: 1422
From: Germany
Registered: May 2000

posted 09-16-2008 11:49 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for spaceflori   Click Here to Email spaceflori     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Absolutely correct -- the Apollo 17 cover is probably the closest thing to an insurance cover you can get!

Ken Havekotte
Member

Posts: 2082
From: Merritt Island, Florida, Brevard
Registered: Mar 2001

posted 09-16-2008 02:28 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Ken Havekotte   Click Here to Email Ken Havekotte     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
The original concept of special-use Apollo covers started with Apollo 11 (three cachet designs) in which Mike Collins was approached by the MSC Stamp Club to see if any of his crew would want to purchase, sign, and philatelically process such covers as a "crew insurance cover."

As explained in earlier posts of mine on various cS-topic forums here, there was a special astronaut-insignia cachet envelope designed for Apollo 12 that the crew did in fact use as insurance covers. Both the special astronauts' personal cachet envelopes along with others from the MSC Stamp Club were used by the crew families as insurance covers for Apollos 12 through 16.

From my observations though, apparently, there were no MSCSC-cachet varieties from Apollo 12 and 16 that were used by the crews for such a purpose.

In my opinion, any Apollo 17 covers would not fit into earlier known or established crew insurance-type covers. If Cernan and his crew mates indeed had some that were produced, which may still be possible, why are we only seeing those that have no original flight-era mission postal cancellations or markings on them?

All times are CT (US)

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