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  Still The Right Stuff's replica Apollo flight jackets (Page 1)

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Author Topic:   Still The Right Stuff's replica Apollo flight jackets
Robert Pearlman
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posted 12-03-2013 03:17 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Robert Pearlman   Click Here to Email Robert Pearlman     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
collectSPACE
Apollo couture: Astronaut offers replica of iconic NASA flight jacket

An Apollo astronaut, looking to keep the "right stuff" forefront in the public's eye, has recreated his iconic NASA-issued blue flight jacket down to the last button.

Al Worden, who in 1971 flew to the moon as the pilot of the Apollo 15 command module Endeavour, wore out his original flight jacket years ago. But working with a space enthusiast out of London, Worden has now reproduced the distinctive NASA outerwear as a museum-quality replica, which is being offered for sale.

Worden, collaborating with British attorney Steve Pidcock, has founded "Still The Right Stuff" to create what Worden labels as the "Apollo Flight Jacket."

"We discussed ways and methods of remembering the past greatness of the Apollo flights," Worden wrote in the letter that will accompany each of the jackets sold. "What could we do to keep the flame of exploration foremost in the minds of people who care?"

"The answer," Worden explained, "was to offer authentic Apollo-era flight jackets to a small but dedicated group of space enthusiasts."

Robert Pearlman
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posted 12-03-2013 03:24 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Robert Pearlman   Click Here to Email Robert Pearlman     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
A website for Still The Right Stuff is forthcoming, but in the interim, orders can be placed with Alexander Leather Jackets. For details: info@alexanderleathers.com.

Each garment will be tailored to the customer so they will need the following please to ensure that your jacket fits correctly.

  1. Shoulder width
  2. Chest (widest part)
  3. Length (base of collar to bottom of waist band)
  4. Sleeve length (from end of shoulder to desired length at end of wrist knit)
  5. Waist measurement at desired length of garment)
  6. Waist measurement at widest point if different from (5) above and point at which widest measurement falls by reference to length of jacket.

Hart Sastrowardoyo
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posted 12-03-2013 07:12 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Hart Sastrowardoyo   Click Here to Email Hart Sastrowardoyo     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Is the leather ID tag removable or is it part of the jacket?

Robert Pearlman
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posted 12-03-2013 07:43 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Robert Pearlman   Click Here to Email Robert Pearlman     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I do not know for certain, but the jacket that was on display at the Astronaut Autograph and Memorabilia Show last month did have a removable velcro name tag.

Shuttle Endeavour
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posted 12-03-2013 08:29 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Shuttle Endeavour   Click Here to Email Shuttle Endeavour     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Any idea how much one jacket will cost?

Robert Pearlman
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posted 12-03-2013 08:36 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Robert Pearlman   Click Here to Email Robert Pearlman     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
From the article:
Orders for the replica Apollo flight jacket have just begun through Alexander Leather Jackets in Scotland. The blue jacket is £450 (pound sterling), which at current exchange rates is about $740 (US).

moon lander
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posted 12-04-2013 06:33 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for moon lander   Click Here to Email moon lander     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Hart Sastrowardoyo:
Is the leather ID tag removable or is it part of the jacket?
I asked the same question when I saw pictures of this great looking jacket and the wings/name are on velcro, just like the originals.

spaceman
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posted 12-04-2013 01:17 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for spaceman   Click Here to Email spaceman     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Link to the jacket: Alexander Leathers

p51
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posted 12-04-2013 02:36 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for p51   Click Here to Email p51     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I can't say all of them, but many of the these original jackets had the leather nameplates sewn directly to the jacket. Velcro would be good for modern users so you could clean it easier, though.

Wow. Want one very badly. Wife said it all, "There's no way you're getting a jacket that cost that much, you'd never wear it out of the house."

Jurg Bolli
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posted 12-04-2013 03:53 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Jurg Bolli   Click Here to Email Jurg Bolli     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Sadly these are pretty much the same words as those of my wife!

JBoe
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posted 12-04-2013 04:26 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for JBoe   Click Here to Email JBoe     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I concur with the wives' comments, I won't be sporting the jacket either

Anyways, I was interested in the details of the Astronaut Wings on the leather patch. Thanks!

Robert Pearlman
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posted 12-04-2013 04:45 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Robert Pearlman   Click Here to Email Robert Pearlman     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by JBoe:
I was interested in the details of the Astronaut Wings on the leather patch.
That is the Still The Right Stuff logo:

JBoe
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posted 12-04-2013 04:55 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for JBoe   Click Here to Email JBoe     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Robert, thanks again! I'm assuming the "wings" are not indicative of the "official" ones correct?

Robert Pearlman
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posted 12-04-2013 05:02 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Robert Pearlman   Click Here to Email Robert Pearlman     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
The logo shares similarities with, but is not identical to, the official Air Force wings.

328KF
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posted 12-05-2013 07:16 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for 328KF   Click Here to Email 328KF     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
While I appreciate the work put into finding the original materials and the attention to detail, the price point on this is just too high for a garment like this. Original, astronaut-owned jackets have sold in the $1000 range, and a current NASA jacket from the contractor can be had for $200 or so, and that's real Nomex.

Flight Suits ltd. will do custom sizes for a nominal fee over the standard cuts.

It looks cool, and I was pretty excited when I read the article until I saw the price. I'd be willing to pay about half that, and even then I might wear it to an autograph show or two a year.

p51
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posted 12-06-2013 01:48 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for p51   Click Here to Email p51     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
My actual initial sentiments are almost exactly as 328KF posted above. I'm just glad I wasn't the first to note that.

When I looked into space collecting, I immediately noted a trend for extremely high-priced items that perhaps didn't need to be so. This jacket typifies this. There's simply no reason at all why an affordable half-decent copy of this (or the yellow ones) could be made. Over $700 each is simply playing up to the type of person who buys something just so they can brag about how much they paid for the thing. Meanwhile, any sane space enthusiast is left out in the cold. We're not talking about a flown Apollo glove or Armstrong's signature (or anything rare and finite), they could make these for any price range they really wanted.

Hart Sastrowardoyo
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posted 12-06-2013 02:26 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Hart Sastrowardoyo   Click Here to Email Hart Sastrowardoyo     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Affordability notwithstanding, I'd be afraid to wear a jacket of the price for everyday activities — which is what I do with the clothes I like. No sense of buying a jacket if you ain't gonna use it.

Robert Pearlman
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posted 12-06-2013 02:33 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Robert Pearlman   Click Here to Email Robert Pearlman     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by p51:
There's simply no reason at all why an affordable half-decent copy of this (or the yellow ones) could be made.
Sure, a half-descent copy could be made cheaper, if you want to cut the quality.

But that's not what Still The Right Stuff set out to do, nor are they fleecing (no pun intended) enthusiasts.

It is a granted that for many $750 may be too expensive for the jacket they want to wear. But it's less than what many people pay for a fine quality, custom tailored leather jacket, not to mention what is paid for custom-tailored two and three piece suits. (Can you find either for less? Sure. But that doesn't negate the market for the higher-end clothiers.)

What people pay for an artifact versus what people pay for clothing they are going to wear is perhaps a poor comparison as it assumes the value propositions are the same. For some, it is worth investing more into an item they are going to use rather than only admire.

Is $750 the right price for everyone? No. But Worden admits that when he states, "The answer was to offer authentic Apollo-era flight jackets to a small but dedicated group of space enthusiasts."

There will be those who will want the jacket but won't be able to afford it. There will be those who want the jacket, cannot immediately afford it, but who will save for it, just as someone saves for any large purchase. And there will be those who want the jacket and can afford it and will buy it immediately.

The size of those separate markets will ultimately determine if Still The Right Stuff is successful.

Teacher in space
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posted 12-06-2013 07:45 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Teacher in space     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
For custom sized and made jacket, that is not too much. A bit pricey but not overly.

xlsteve
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posted 12-06-2013 08:23 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for xlsteve   Click Here to Email xlsteve     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Price not withstanding, I'm not comfortable wearing a flight jacket that I did not earn. That's why I don't wear the copy jackets/flight suits for sale commercially. I don't fault others for doing so, that's just my choice. I guess it's my military background.

p51
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posted 12-06-2013 11:04 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for p51   Click Here to Email p51     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by xlsteve:
Price not withstanding, I'm not comfortable wearing a flight jacket that I did not earn.
I'm a former Army officer, and I have no problem with it at all.

Flight jackets aren't 'earned', no more than a field jacket or combat boots. It's not a medal.

328KF
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posted 12-06-2013 11:34 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for 328KF   Click Here to Email 328KF     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I think an item like this is no different than wearing a sports jersey of your favorite team or player. The average fan didn't earn that, but it shows your support and pride for whatever the garment represents.

Philip
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posted 12-07-2013 08:50 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Philip   Click Here to Email Philip     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
The wings should go on the left sice (worn onto the heart).

p51
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posted 12-08-2013 12:09 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for p51   Click Here to Email p51     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Philip:
The wings should go on the left sice (worn onto the heart).
Actually, NASA crews wore them on their right side back in the Apollo era. It's quite historically correct.

xlsteve
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posted 12-09-2013 08:06 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for xlsteve   Click Here to Email xlsteve     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by p51:
Flight jackets aren't 'earned', no more than a field jacket or combat boots. It's not a medal.

I'm former Army enlisted. I would argue that you earn the right to wear combat boots and field jacket by doing what is necessary to earn the right to wear the uniform (completing Basic Training and AIT). There are whole web sites dedicated to outing people who wear the uniform who never served, or who wear medals they did not earn in order to get attention. Not that I put this in the same category.

It's just my personal opinion, and as I stated before I don't fault anyone else for wearing them.

David C
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posted 12-18-2013 02:33 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for David C     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by p51:
Flight jackets aren't 'earned', no more than a field jacket or combat boots. It's not a medal.
As a retired naval aviator I agree. As a youth I used to get burnt up about seeing sloppy civilians in combat jackets etc but I've grown up since then. A jacket is just a jacket, the insignia, patches, wings, etc., an entirely different matter. I'll be getting a couple, but they won't have any NASA patches. I'm not an Apollo astronaut.

Gonzo
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posted 12-18-2013 09:41 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Gonzo   Click Here to Email Gonzo     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I agree with the sentiments above. I am retired enlisted AF. I did not work as part of a flight crew. I did not wear a flight jacket or flight suit. And I will not.

To me it is not about *support* of the crews that do. Rather, the people I see wearing things like this or sports team jackets for that matter are, to be blunt, what we call posers or wannabees. That is, they WISH they could have done this or that, but didn't (or couldn't). So yes, to me, wearing a flight jacket or flight suit is indicative of your achievements. Choosing not to wear one when you haven't paid the price (figuratively, not monetarily), indicates respect to those that have.

Jim Behling
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posted 12-18-2013 11:50 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Jim Behling   Click Here to Email Jim Behling     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by xlsteve:
I'm former Army enlisted. I would argue that you earn the right to wear combat boots and field jacket by doing what is necessary to earn the right to wear the uniform (completing Basic Training and AIT).
I agree.

p51
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posted 12-18-2013 12:17 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for p51   Click Here to Email p51     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I look at it this way, you'd NEVER be mistaken for an Apollo astronaut if you're under the age of 60 or so.

Just the same as plenty of people buy and wear WW2 flight jackets who are way too young to have actually been in WW2 and the WW2 vets don't seem to mind at all (I've been a WW2 re-enactor since the 1980s, and I've never once encountered a WW2 vet who didn't like the fact that people were still wearing them today).

As for the 'poser' comment, that I guess would also apply to anyone wearing anything with any NASA logo or such thing on it. For that matter, wouldn't collecting items from missions you never went on fall under the same heading? Models of rockets you never flew on? Autographs from people you never met?

I guess I have to ask, if the astronauts themsevles don't seem to mind (especially the REAL Apollo astronaut, Al Worden, who started the project), why would any of you?

Gonzo
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posted 12-18-2013 12:35 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Gonzo   Click Here to Email Gonzo     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
And that's a valid point. I can't decide for you. If you want to wear one, by all means, to each his own. That doesn't mean I have to agree with it.

As far as your WWII reenactments and wearing the garb worn then, I have no issues with it. That to me is done BECAUSE of respect. It's different. What bothers me about all this is the, "look at me! I'm just as cool as those guys because I can wear a jacket!". Well, to be blunt once again, no you're not. You're a poser/wannabe. You want to be regarded the same as those that paid the price, but don't want to pay the dues to get it. You're trying to get something you don't deserve.

On the other hand, reenactments are done as a sign of respect. You know, and so does everyone else, that you're not a WWII vet. You are doing what you do out of respect for those that are WWII vets and what they did. You're not trying to be one. See the difference?

The flight jackets? If you have the cash to buy one, more power to you. Just don't wear it thinking you're as cool as a real astronaut! Keep it in the back of your mind that you're no more than a poser. You may think you're wearing it out of respect, but the truth is, you're probably doing it for the attention...

Robert Pearlman
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posted 12-18-2013 12:43 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Robert Pearlman   Click Here to Email Robert Pearlman     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Gonzo:
You may think you're wearing it out of respect, but the truth is, you're probably doing it for the attention...
I wore a shuttle-era flight jacket for most of my youth, even in high school, and yes, I did wear it for attention — not for me, but attention for the space program.

I found that by wearing the flight jacket in public, at the mall, to the movies and elsewhere, I had people (of all ages) stop me and ask about it. And that provided an excellent opportunity to tell them more about NASA's current activities and why the space program was important to the nation.

And I think that's what Al Worden and Steve Pidcock had in mind when creating their replica Apollo jacket. They want people to take notice, to remember the moon landings and inquire and/or yearn for them again.

chet
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posted 12-18-2013 02:52 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for chet   Click Here to Email chet     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Excellent rebuttal, Robert... my sentiments exactly. If you think the jackets look cool and want to wear one, I see it not at all as pretentious (haven't all of us here fantasized about what it would have been like to be one of the Apollo astronauts?), but just wanting to wear something that looks great and can start up conversations with anyone else who also might find the look impressive.

Anything anyone does insofar as collecting "space" is exhibiting "wannabe" behavior to one degree or another; why denigrate that?

Hart Sastrowardoyo
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posted 12-18-2013 03:39 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Hart Sastrowardoyo   Click Here to Email Hart Sastrowardoyo     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Out of curiosity, what's the position with those who wear a flight jacket but aren't astronauts or necessarily fliers - NASA support staff who greet the crew members upon landing in Russia? Are they posers or should they be wearing them?

David C
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posted 12-18-2013 05:55 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for David C     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
And whilst pondering that, I think terming these astronaut flight jackets is a bit of a misnomer. More likely these are NASA MSC flight jackets since the aircraft ops guys wore them too. We're not calling them wannabes are we?

p51
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posted 12-18-2013 06:37 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for p51   Click Here to Email p51     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by David C:
And whilst pondering that, I think terming these astronaut flight jackets is a bit of a misnomer. More likely these are NASA MSC flight jackets since the aircraft ops guys wore them too. We're not calling them wannabes are we?
Military collectors get this kind of thing all the time. Re-enactors, too (especially WW2 ones, where the units and awards are somewhat aligned with current ones).

There's always the crowd that says, "Only the people back in the day can -" have/wear/collect/look at things the real people did back in the day, or do so now.

And in a case like this, many of the people crying loudest that it is wrong to even own such a thing probably have some of the biggest collections of items that they, too, never 'earned', from missions they never went on, from a space agency they probably never worked for. It's a good thing my hypocrisy meter's batteries need changing right now, I just got it out of the shop from the least thread like this I read...

The ONLY thing keeping me from buying one of these jackets is the whopping price tag. My wife would never let me spend that much on something like this, and I'd be terrified to wear something that expensive in public for fear of it being damaged or soiled in some way. The idea that few (if any) people on this site EARNED the right to buy something made by an astronaut for the collecting public is, in my opinion, the height of silliness.

Hart Sastrowardoyo
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posted 12-18-2013 10:37 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Hart Sastrowardoyo   Click Here to Email Hart Sastrowardoyo     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Not to mention, these jackets and flight suits (and polo shirts) are available not only in kid sizes, but also in adult sizes, too. Point being if they didn't want the public to wear them, they would only make them in kids' sizes for playwear.

kr4mula
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posted 12-19-2013 12:25 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for kr4mula   Click Here to Email kr4mula     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I think the sports team jersey is the best analogy here. You wear something like that to show your interest in and support for your team. No one is going to mistake short, skinny, 40-year old me for an NFL player (not even a punter!) when I wear my Cincinnati Bengals jersey, nor am I pretending to be one. You wear it to identify yourself with a set of interests that will be acknowledged by others with similar interests. That doesn't make me a poseur; it makes me a fan.

If I wear this jacket, almost no one is going to recognize it for what it is, much less mistake me for an 80-year-old test pilot. For those who do recognize it, there's absolutely no chance they will mistake me for an Apollo astronaut, but maybe it'll strike up a conversation with other fans of the space program.

Maybe the circumstances are different if you go around wearing a current uniform, medals, etc. with a resonable chance that you'd be mistaken for a soldier, pilot, etc., but this jacket is way far out of that realm.

kr4mula
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posted 12-19-2013 01:08 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for kr4mula   Click Here to Email kr4mula     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Interesting aside from the website:
We will also be releasing an exciting numbered limited edition Al Worden signature jacket with real silk lining along with accurate accessories in the coming months...

northcoast aerospace
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posted 12-21-2013 04:32 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for northcoast aerospace   Click Here to Email northcoast aerospace     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Looks like an awesome flight jacket! I hope that there will be a gold PBI cloth version in the future along with the NASA extended vector patch with the white border.

I agree with those who would like to see them produced in a larger quantity and at a lower price. Maybe then the jackets could be produced up to a 4XLL size?

Gibson & Barnes sells a variety of leather and embroidered nameplates for flight jackets.

Robert Pearlman
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posted 12-21-2013 04:36 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Robert Pearlman   Click Here to Email Robert Pearlman     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by northcoast aerospace:
Maybe then the jackets could be produced up to a 4XLL size?
The jackets, as currently offered, are made to the customer's measurements, so are therefore available in all sizes.


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