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  Lunar Landing Training Vehicle (LLTV) pilots

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Author Topic:   Lunar Landing Training Vehicle (LLTV) pilots
ambrous
Member

Posts: 13
From: indianapolis, in
Registered: Feb 2008

posted 08-27-2012 01:57 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for ambrous     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Is there a list somewhere of which astronauts (or non-astronauts) flew the LLTV or LLRV? Was it just the landing commanders and backups or did others fly as well?

I would assume... Armstrong, Conrad, Lovell, Shepard, Scott, Young, Cernan, Gordon, Haise...

Beau08
Member

Posts: 140
From: Peoria, AZ United States
Registered: Aug 2011

posted 08-27-2012 02:12 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Beau08   Click Here to Email Beau08     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Here is a NASA litho that states on the back that these are the astronauts that used the LLTV. (Thanks benfairfax for photo...)

ambrous
Member

Posts: 13
From: indianapolis, in
Registered: Feb 2008

posted 08-27-2012 02:46 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for ambrous     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Thanks for the nice image. I had a bit of trouble reading the signatures, but I did not see Armstrong, Conrad or Lovell on it. Perhaps the names are those who flew the LLTV and not the LLRV or just this particular LLTV?

Robert Pearlman
Editor

Posts: 27328
From: Houston, TX
Registered: Nov 1999

posted 08-27-2012 03:19 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Robert Pearlman   Click Here to Email Robert Pearlman     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
The astronauts who signed the litho are:
  • Neil Armstrong
  • Eugene Cernan
  • Charles Conrad
  • Richard Gordon
  • Fred Haise
  • James Lovell
  • David Scott
  • Alan Shepard
  • John Young
The pilots are:
  • Joe Algranti
  • Jere Cobb
  • Stuart Present
  • Bud Ream

MSS
Member

Posts: 372
From: Kolo, Poland
Registered: May 2003

posted 08-27-2012 03:40 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for MSS     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Just read at Wikipedia: Lunar Landing Research Vehicle & this link also

------------------
Maciej, Astronauts, Cosmonauts & their flights

micropooz
Member

Posts: 1239
From: Washington, DC, USA
Registered: Apr 2003

posted 08-27-2012 06:54 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for micropooz   Click Here to Email micropooz     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
More than you can imagine about the LLRV and LLTV. Includes mostly complete logs of LLRV 1 and 2 flights, and summary totals (no detailed logs though) of astronaut training flights. Good stuff!

Henry Heatherbank
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Posts: 146
From: Adelaide, South Australia
Registered: Apr 2005

posted 08-28-2012 06:36 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Henry Heatherbank     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Given that Young, Gordon and Cernan flew it, I guess it is safe to assume it was in use until some time in 1971? I am assuming Young first flew it as Apollo 13 backup CDR in 1969/70, Cernan as Apollo 14 backup CDR in 1970 and Gordon as Apollo 15 backup CDR in 1970/71.

Did Young or Cernan then fly it into 1972 as prime crew CDRs in training for Apollo 16 and 17, respectively (or for that matter, did Gordon fly it whilst still in the running as candidate for Apollo 17 CDR once Apollo 18 had been axed?).

Prior to this topic, I had assumed it was no longer used after 1969, once Apollo 11 and 12 were out of the way, because of safety concerns, and that NASA considered it an unnecessary risk.

heng44
Member

Posts: 2564
From: Netherlands
Registered: Nov 2001

posted 08-28-2012 06:55 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for heng44   Click Here to Email heng44     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Scott, Young and Cernan flew it as CDR about one month prior to their respective launches. I have photos of all three in the cockpit. The backup CDRs also flew it in that timeframe. The tethered LLRF at Langley was discontinued in 1970, but the LLTV flew until November 1972. I believe Armstrong and Conrad stressed that the LLTV simulated the LM landing very accurately.

ambrous
Member

Posts: 13
From: indianapolis, in
Registered: Feb 2008

posted 10-19-2012 08:35 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for ambrous     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I was watching the video "The Space Duet of Gumdrop and Spider."

It appears to have footage of Jim McDivitt flying the LLTV at 5:54. I am not sure why this would be needed for flying the LM in Earth orbit. Although with the editing, he may be on some other device and not the LLTV. But, why would this NASA film even have footage of the LLTV in flight if it was not used for the flight?

randy
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Posts: 1287
From: West Jordan, Utah USA
Registered: Dec 1999

posted 10-19-2012 09:53 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for randy   Click Here to Email randy     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
In the book "Unconventional, Contrary and Ugly: The Lunar Landing Research Vehicle", the following pilots are also mentioned:

Joseph A. Walker, NASA FRC; Donald L. Mallick, NASA FRC and Emil "Jack" Kluever, Army Pilot assigned to NASA FRC.

heng44
Member

Posts: 2564
From: Netherlands
Registered: Nov 2001

posted 10-20-2012 02:16 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for heng44   Click Here to Email heng44     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by ambrous:
It appears to have footage of Jim McDivitt flying the LLTV at 5:54.
I asked McDivitt about that for an article I wrote on the LLTV many years ago. He said he and Schweickart only flew the tethered LLRF at Langley, not the LLRV/LLTV.

The footage of McDivitt in the film suggests he flew the LLTV, but it is actually of the parachute training that you see right after this segment. Astronauts are pushed off a wooden tower in a sort of ejection seat. The cutaway shot of a group of astronauts looking up was also filmed during this parachute training. Mixing it with actual footage of the LLTV is confusing, to say the least.

Don't let the hoax-believers hear this...

Jay Chladek
Member

Posts: 2211
From: Bellevue, NE, USA
Registered: Aug 2007

posted 10-20-2012 07:15 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Jay Chladek   Click Here to Email Jay Chladek     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I seem to recall that Bill Anders also flew it, but I don't know if his flights were related to the original high orbit LM test intended for Borman's crew, or if he was part of the astronaut crew that would evaluate the LLTV for a practical use as a landing simulation.

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