posted 07-13-2009 09:46 PM               

quote:

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Originally posted by Lou Chinal:
Which leads me to the question, did the nine Gemini pilots have to go though the Lovelace Clinic in Albuquerque?

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posted 07-16-2009 04:30 PM               

Dr. Lamb appears to have retained enough institutional support, however, from LBJ and others to win the NASA contract for post-Mercury medical examinations.

But back to Ed White. I've been thumbing through my copy of the Lamb book. It turns out that Ed White gets the lion's share of text devoted to early astronauts not named Deke. Some observations follow, in no particular order:

Lamb writes that Brooks AFB celebrated a postflight Ed White Day on June 17, 1965, attended by Ed and his son. There's a nice photo in the book. That day White and Dr. Lamb had an intense conversation about his weight loss in space (9 lbs.).

White also told Lamb that day that before he made his space flight, he had been in the "best physical condition" of his life. "In Ed's case," Lamb observes, "that would have represented the fitness level equivalent to an Olympic athlete" (p. 363). More about this comparison below.

On p. 253, Dr. Lamb describes a series of six articles that had appeared in the Houston Chronicle entitled "Astronaut: The Magnificent Male," first published on Nov. 4, 1962. These articles might be excellent source material on the Gemini-era medical evals.

The publication of the story in the Chronicle, it turns out, was the occasion for yet another nasty turf battle in the NASA-USAF medical group (long story). Ed White wrote to Dr. Lamb in support of Brooks and in his letter asks rather companionably if Dr. Lamb had improved on his "daily mile" and refers with evident pleasure to his own record (26 minutes) on the treadmill at Brooks (p. 255).

Letters of support for the beleaguered Brooks medical team came also from Pete Conrad and Frank Borman (p. 256).

Lamb writes, regarding Group 2 selection, that "None of the astronaut candidates were completely without any deviation from perfect health, but as a group they were very healthy." Brooks (really, the School of Aerospace Medicine, housed at Brooks) had a comparison group of Olympic pentathletes training nearby who were "much leaner and about ten years younger" than the candidates at Brooks. "Only half of the astronaut candidates had low cholesterol values within the range seen in the pentathletes." So Lamb has essentially established that Ed White had the cholesterol values of an Olympic athlete, age 25.

Lamb then singles Ed White out for his "topnotch" athleticism and his interest in the physiology of exercise. FWIW, White disapproved of NASA's policy with regard to physical conditioning, which was left to the discretion of the individual astronaut.

Given Lamb's evident admiration for White's cardiovascular fitness in mid-1965 (Lamb singles out only White and Glenn in this regard), it seems unlikely that White could have developed "severely blocked arteries" by January 1967.

I guess my questions here, Colin, would focus on these other cardiologists who you write were "interviewed on the subject." Who are they? Where are the interviews? Can they be cited? Were they present at the autopsy? Where are their reports? And so on.

posted 07-16-2009 05:40 PM               

quote:

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Originally posted by KC Stoever:
Given Lamb's evident admiration for White's cardiovascular fitness in mid-1965 (Lamb singles out only White and Glenn in this regard), it seems unlikely that White could have developed "severely blocked arteries" by January 1967.

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It's possible for someone to be in apparent excellent physical condition regarding endurance, strength, and agility, but still have an underlying undetected condition that could cause problems later.

posted 07-16-2009 06:32 PM               

Apparent health is just that. An appearance, not the thing itself.

The common-sense difficulty of your otherwise reasonable observation is that Dr. Lawrence E. Lamb was privy to Ed White's actual--and not apparent--"excellent physical condition," having read White's EKGs, seen his cholesterol levels, and listened to his heart pump after a record-setting treadmill run.

It's pretty clear from reading Lamb's book that he viewed White's health as something of a phenomenon. I am interested, now, in who these unnamed cardiologists are who have suggested otherwise.

posted 07-17-2009 01:51 AM               

Cardiac catheterization was done as early as the late 1920's, but visualization of the coronary arteries wasn't routinely done until the late 60's, early 70's, the first was done by accident, and the first paper on this procedure was published in 1966. As for cholesterol levels, there was correlation between high cholesterol levels and heart disease, but it wasn't until 1975 did we determine the mechanism - good and bad cholesterol. Statins entered in 1985.

So in those days, doctors can only look by x-rays for the size of the heart and calcifications in the aorta, EKGs to see changes at rest and exercise, ausculation - listening to the heart for any valvular disease, and any strong family history. The only way to determine if an individual had "heart blockage" is by an autopsy. A perfect example of a individual who was in great shape was the runner Jim Fixx who died in 1985 from a massive heart attack at age 52. I believe that his father died of an MI at age 35.

With regards to statins, although it has significantly reduced the risk of MIs, nearly 30% of the patients taking them still die from heart disease - so statins are not the magic bullet.

posted 07-17-2009 02:10 AM               

The newspaper is "Today" (not sure where it is published in the U.S.) dated Sunday, March 26, 1972. The columnist was Al Marsh, TODAY Science Writer.

The late Ed White II qualified as an astronaut and performed America's first spacewalk despite a severe heart condition neither he nor NASA doctors knew about, a nationally syndicated cardiologist said this weekend.

Dr. Lawrence Lamb, a former NASA doctor, said in a telephone interview from San Antonio, White had severe blockage of one coronary artery due to fatty deposits containing cholesterol.

The other artery, Lamb said, had enlarged itself to provide an adequate blood supply to the heart muscle.

White's severe heart condition was not learned until after the January 1967 Apollo fire which killed White, Gus Grissom and Roger Chaffee.

NASA life sciences director Dr. Charles Berry said in Washington Friday he and other doctors ordered special attention be paid to White's heart during the autopsy. But he said records of the autopsy were not immediately available to him Friday.

"There was a problem before Gemini 4 (in 1965) with his heart beat being too slow. We thought during the spacewalk his heartbeat might slow still further and this was a concern.

"We found nothing during testing to indicate any problem," Berry said. "I don't remember anything in the report about blockage of a coronary artery."

Berry expressed surprise any doctors might know about the report outside of NASA.

Lamb admitted he had not seen the autopsy, but heard its results through professional sources. Tallahassee cardiologist Dr. Orson Smith mentioned White's heart condition on a television show last week, but said he had no first-hand knowledge of the autopsy report.

Sources said White was able to stay alive only because of his excellent physical condition and practice of daily exercise.

A Gainesville cardiologist, who also said he has heard reports of White's heart condition over the years, said White "could have had a heart attack at any time," and added White's case shows it is possible to "have an undiagnosed coronary heart condition."

Lamb disagreed, saying White was in no danger of having a heart attack. White's personal routine of physical exercise forced his heart to enlarge the one remaining coronary artery and serve the heart as well as two, Lamb said.

posted 07-17-2009 10:10 AM               

I noticed that Ed White's crate was pulled out and opened before I had arrived? This was back in 1997. I opened the crate (with others present) and found all kinds of things in it. There was a clear plastic bag of viles with his blood samples in it, some were dried up, other were not. There were notebooks of doctor reports but they were not sealed in plastic and with the high humidity in there they fell apart. There were a lot of other things in the crate, and the spacesuit and helmet were packed away in a green army type bag with a lock on each. I did not want to disturb the affects without permission from the family.

I do know that I contacted the National Archives to let them know of the humid condition in there so that they could maybe salvage whatever they could and they advised me that they had been in there and saved a lot of items that were wet and damaged before I had arrived. They did not know of the reports in the crates.

Long story short, they may have a copy. I know that they said a lot of the original photos were really damaged. I believe that each of the three wooden crates for Grissom, White, and Chaffee had the autopsy reports and photos for each astronaut in them.

The reason the inside of the building got that way was because NASA turned off the nitrogen purge after 10 years. Congress mandated that the purge stay on for at least that period of time. It seems very odd to me that NASA would seal all of the individual spacecraft components and everything in plastic bags and would let the astronaut autopsy results and medical records go to heck with out trying to seal them in some way? I would think that there are copies elsewhere.

posted 07-17-2009 01:30 PM               

I suppose I've advanced the discussion as much as I can.

Best to have first-hand report, of course: an interview with doctor who was present at the autopsy, while he or she is reviewing the actual report. Then follow up with 21st-century specialists reviewing that first-hand report.

posted 07-17-2009 03:06 PM               

For a man to have "significant" amount of coronary artery disease at age 37 is very unusual, there must be some underlying genetic defect. Diet alone cannot do that, but it will catch up with you as you get older if you don't change you habits. Even if he had a normal cholesterol level, it doesn't mean anything unless you fractionate between the bad cholesterol "LDL" from good cholesterol "HDL." I have seen patients with normal cholesterol levels and a normal or low LDL levels that have a significant amount coronary artery disease that needs to be bypassed because they have very low HDL levels or some other defect. Family history is also very important. The gold standard for determining coronary artery disease is coronary angiography. In the 60's it was in it's infancy and the risks may outweigh the benefits. Echocardiography, a non-invasive approach, did not come into play until the late 70's.

Unless Col. White admitted symptoms of "angina" or chest pain or EKG changes were observed, one cannot say he had heart disease. His low heart rate can be attributed to his great physical condition. Athletes do have heart rates in the 60's while at rest. When people go below 50, I tend to worry and that's when people become symptomatic.

Could Col. White have had coronary artery disease? It's possible. How extensive, I don't know. Did exercise help him, yes, but if there was a genetic defect, then exercise and diet can go only so far.

Hope I didn't stand on the soap box too long. I guess what I am saying is that anybody can fit in this scenario and they should be on top of things with their health care.

posted 07-31-2009 02:54 PM               

quote:

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Originally posted by andrewcli:
Other examples of individuals that die unexpectedly are athletes. I remember several basketball players died from heart failure - they didn't have heart disease or abnormal cholesterol levels, but had electrical conduction problems and when pushed hard, the heart fails.

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posted 08-01-2009 05:17 PM               

As someone with a deep but sensitive interest in the lives of the three Apollo 1 astronauts (as Eddie knows, for we spoke at length by telephone for my book, "Fallen Astronauts"), all I am seeking to do is investigate the elusive truth behind these lingering allegations so I can finally set the record straight. To date, however, neither Dr. Lamb nor Mr. Lockney has responded to my messages asking about the validity of their so-called "findings".

posted 02-10-2015 03:07 PM               

Vladimir Komarov became the first Soviet casualty of space flight in April 1967. He is seen here training for an earlier Vostok flight as a back-up. In the early 1960's a heart disorder had led to his removal from flight operations. Only by obtaining sworn statements from Moscow specialists which said that the condition was not serious was he able to regain flight status.