posted 08-21-2009 11:38 AM               

quote:

---

Originally posted by capoetc:
People aren't paying $350 or more for Aldrin's signature -- they could find it cheaper elsewhere. They are paying for the experience...

---

posted 08-21-2009 01:40 PM               

quote:

---

Originally posted by alanh_7:
I could not agree more. What an experience.

---

An experience indeed. The two times I had stuff signed in person by Aldrin, he never uttered a word one of those times and was a bit distracted the other time (and mostly talking to his handler)...only grunting a few words in my direction about where I wanted him to sign. I wrote off both experiences to bad luck...and realize others have had better interactions with Buzz. Regardless, I was happy with the signatures.

But I would caution anyone against spending $350+ with Buzz and expecting a great interaction. You may not get what you're hoping for.

posted 08-21-2009 03:25 PM               

My experience at the first SpaceFest was great. Buzz was friendly, we talked for a few minutes after he signed my item, and he gladly posed for a picture with me, holding up the photograph he had signed.

At the second SpaceFest he was perfunctory and difficult, charging me more ($450) for a multi-signed "First Step" lithograph than his posted fee. (I was happy I had a number of things signed by him back when his fee was only $100).

In Buzz' defense, there are a lot of people who have tried to take advantage of him over the years. Also, he is human like all of us -- we have good days and bad days.

posted 08-21-2009 05:25 PM               

The be fair it was very busy. We do not get many moonwalkers in Toronto and the crowd was fair size.

posted 08-21-2009 07:26 PM               

quote:

---

Originally posted by jamato99:
I'd like to know what percentage of Aldrin's fee (and all the astronauts for that matter) are donated to the ASF...

---

How we spend the money we earn, whether we are collectors or astronauts, is a private affair.

posted 08-21-2009 09:10 PM               

quote:

---

Originally posted by AJ:
if any of us goes to ASF and spends money on an autograph, we are doing so with the expectation that part of that money is going to charity and part is going to the astronaut.

---

All proceeds from ticket sales benefit the Astronaut Scholarship Foundation, a 501(c)(3) nonprofit organization, who aids the United States in retaining its world leadership in science and technology by providing scholarships to exceptional college students pursuing degrees in these fields. Cost of the ticket packages, over fair market value, is considered a charitable donation.

posted 08-22-2009 05:16 AM               

quote:

---

Originally posted by mjanovec:
An experience indeed. The two times I had stuff signed in person by Aldrin, he never uttered a word one of those times ...only grunting a few words in my direction about where I wanted him to sign..

---

I couldn't agree more. At the last ASF show I spent a considerable amount, only to get brusquely questioned by his handler about whether I was going to sell my items (none of her business), with not even a "hello", "thank you" or anything else from the man himself. Good manners cost nothing, but I would have thought $350 (x6) bought a pretty good amount of manners. I wouldn't expect a shop assistant not to thank me for spending such an amount, so why should I accept anything less from an astronaut?

posted 08-22-2009 05:24 AM               

quote:

---

Originally posted by AJ:
If money from what we choose to spend is indeed going to ASF I think it's only reasonable to wonder how much.

---

posted 08-22-2009 07:20 AM               

1. Such information can set up a false impression that show attendees are supporting the ASF by buying autographs from the astronauts (or worse, certain astronauts). While some of the money spent on signatures may eventually make its way to the Foundation, it is the astronauts who are donating the funds, not the show's attendees.

   If attendees want to support the ASF, they can buy premium tickets, attend the dinner and bid in the auction (not to mention make direct donations).

2. It sets up a potentially false ranking of the astronauts. We've already seen one comment here suggest that the astronauts are ranked by levels of altruistic behavior, but that proposes that collectors are privy to all donations, which they are not.

   Some astronauts may decide to donate a percentage of their show fees to the ASF, while others may make separate donations throughout the year and keep the show proceeds for themselves. And some may decide not to donate at all, for which they should not be subject to private or public shame.

posted 08-22-2009 08:51 AM               

quote:

---

Originally posted by Robert Pearlman:
It sets up a potentially false ranking of the astronauts.

---

I don't necessarily think there is anything false about comparing one astronaut who donates his entire weekend to the ASF (and gives 100% of his fees from the autograph show to them)...versus an astronaut who gives basically nothing from his signing fee to the ASF (and walks home with a fat check in hand). Granted, they aren't necessarily required to disclose that fact, but I can't help but have a little more admiration for someone who forgoes the money completely in support of a good cause. If anything, that behavior should be recognized and celebrated!

And yes, even the astronauts who don't donate part of their signing fee help the ASF in other ways (by helping encourage ticket sales and participating in other events, like the dinner), but for the sake of the autograph show itself it is clear some are willing to give up more than others.

posted 08-22-2009 10:59 AM               

quote:

---

Originally posted by mjanovec:
I can't help but have a little more admiration for someone who forgoes the money completely in support of a good cause. If anything, that behavior should be recognized and celebrated!

---

Or what of the person who takes the check home and then at the end of the year makes a private financial donation larger than someone who donated a percentage during the show? Was your admiration well-placed?

posted 08-22-2009 12:22 PM               

quote:

---

Originally posted by Robert Pearlman:
What if that person who keeps his/her fees has steep medical bills for an ailing family member...

---

If any one of those scenarios outlined were the case, I would certainly admire them for donating their money to such worthy causes. However, I don't think that negates any special admiration I have for those who attend the autograph shows and are willing to donate most of their proceeds (and time) to the ASF.

posted 08-22-2009 02:17 PM               

quote:

---

Originally posted by divemaster:
These men and women risked their lives for government pay. They deserve every dime.

---

posted 08-22-2009 08:19 PM               

As was mentioned earlier, I thought I read somewhere before that the ASF autograph show was essentially a fundraiser for the ASF and that the astronauts donated a portion of their fees to the ASF. Maybe I was incorrect in thinking this or maybe I just made that up, but that's what sparked my comment.

I'm not sure what to think now... I was under the impression that at least part of the money being spent on tickets and autographs went to support the ASF (hence the name: "ASF's Autograph and Memorabilia Show". The astronauts don't have to do anything they don't want to do, but I think it should be made clear that this isn't exactly a fundraiser for anyone but the astronauts themselves.

Sure, the astronauts don't have to give a cent to the ASF if they don't want to - much like none of us HAS to donate to any particular charity if we don't want to. But I really thought the whole idea of the ASF putting on this show was to raise money for the ASF. When Sims & Hankow were putting it on, I thought it was more understood that it was purely an autograph show.

The fact that the astronauts all made names for themselves while working for "government pay" is all the more reason to be at least slightly disgusted at some of the outrageous fees they charge for their autographs. These were government employees... way to give back, guys. And, yes, I know it's a free country and they can charge what they want and they don't owe anyone anything. It's just my opinion that the fees they charge and the percentage they choose to donate to the ASF really speaks to each astronaut's character.

posted 08-22-2009 10:02 PM               

quote:

---

Originally posted by Robert Pearlman:
As stated on the ASF website, ticket sales benefit the Foundation, as does the auction they organize as part of the event. ...

---

To piggyback on that, if the astronauts did not attend, nobody would be buying those tickets!

Their presence alone is helping to raise funds for the ASF, even if they keep every dime of their signing fees.

posted 08-23-2009 06:43 AM              

Imagine a group of astronauts talking about us and how damn cheap many collectors are because they are unwilling to pony up a little extra for the next level of ASF ticket.

Last I checked there were still Platinum tickets available. Those of you who disparage astronauts for not donating enough please call the ASF today and upgrade to a Platinum pass. Or just forgo one Buzz autograph and instead write a check to ASF for $350. Go ahead, I dare you. Seems different when looked at the other way, doesn't it?

PS - I was lucky to get my Platinum Plus pass when they were still available.

posted 08-23-2009 07:51 AM               

From having talked to several of the astronauts last year, it seems like most of them contribute to the success of the ASF, both directly and indirectly. They give their time to help make the show more exciting for potential attendees, they donate items for the auction, and they sign items during their down time at the show so that the ASF call sell them in the ASF store. Several of us saw this for ourselves last year. If an astronaut chooses to donate part of their proceeds from the autograph show, that is just icing on the cake.

Finally, I have to share one thing about Buzz. It should probably be posted under Signing Experience: Buzz Aldrin, but since so many in this thread are talking about him here it is. As those who know me are aware, my house burned down last year. My husband and I have six kids, and we are still in the process of recovering and replacing. He worked his butt off to send me to the show last year, but as you can imagine, there wasn't much money available for autographs. Buzz was completely out of the question. I didn't tell him about my house, but I asked on Friday if I could get a picture with him since I could not afford an autograph. Even though there were paying customers behind me in line, he kindly agreed, and two snapshots were taken. He also took a photo with me on Sunday before I left.

posted 08-23-2009 12:06 PM               

quote:

---

Originally posted by freshspot:
Those of you who disparage astronauts for not donating enough please call the ASF today and upgrade to a Platinum pass. Or just forgo one Buzz autograph and instead write a check to ASF for $350. Go ahead, I dare you. Seems different when looked at the other way, doesn't it?

---

Meets everybody's objectives: astronauts make some money; ASF makes loads of money; and you're happy because there will be no more controversy.

posted 08-23-2009 12:23 PM               

quote:

---

Originally posted by freshspot:
Imagine a group of astronauts talking about us and how damn cheap many collectors are because they are unwilling to pony up a little extra for the next level of ASF ticket.

---

posted 08-23-2009 12:26 PM               

quote:

---

Originally posted by jamato99:
I was under the impression that at least part of the money being spent on tickets and autographs went to support the ASF (hence the name: "ASF's Autograph and Memorabilia Show". The astronauts don't have to do anything they don't want to do, but I think it should be made clear that this isn't exactly a fundraiser for anyone but the astronauts themselves.

---

And just why exactly should that be made clear? What spurred the expectation by some that every astronaut should and must donate a percentage of income received at the show to the ASF? This event is not a fundraiser for the "astronauts themselves" - the ASF web page clearly states that "all proceeds from ticket sales benefit the Astronaut Scholarship Foundation..." There is no mention that the astronauts are there for anything else but to sign autographs and attend certain events over the weekend. The event is indeed called The ASF Autograph and Memorabilia Show, and not 'The ASF Charity Show' nor 'The ASF Fundraiser Weekend'. If named either of the latter two I would definitely expect all of the income generated by the astronauts to go to the foundation. But this is not the case.

The folks of the ASF understand they depend on the astronauts greatly. They also realize the astronauts' time is worth something, so why deny them something for that time? That income does not cost the ASF a thing. And also, not one of us here knows exactly what each astronaut does with their money. I think it is unfair that the astronauts are expected to give, give, give all of the time when they give more than their fair share already.

And just to chime in on the annual 'I can't believe he's charging that much for an autograph and I'm not going to pay it' issue, I personally think we are all EXTREMELY lucky astronauts in general do not charge hundreds of dollars for an autograph. Only 12 people have walked on the Moon. 12. In the history of all time - just 12, yet go online and you'll see people paying hundreds of dollars for an autographed 8 X 10 of the latest teen singer or athlete. Now don't start typing your rebuttals if singers or ball players are your thing. I just want to put things in perspective a little regarding overall numbers and rarity. How many singers have there been throughout history? How many ball players? I know, I know - some stand out more than others, but that's the case with everything, even astronauts.

How lucky are we that we live in this time? That we can actually meet, speak and shake hands with an astronaut who walked on the Moon? If not in person, then to be able to write a Moonwalker and receive a personal reply? Only 9 of the 12 are still with us. Only 6 of the 9 attend in-person autograph shows. I wouldn't think twice if they all started charging $500+ per each autograph. In fact, I'd wonder what took them so long. Is it maybe that only when they're all dead that people will feel better paying a few hundred dollars for a Moonwalker's autograph, knowing another can never be signed?

A thousand dollars means different things to different people. Most would agree that it's a lot of money, including me, but I still think it is quite a bargain that one will be able to attend the ASF show in November, meet half the men who walked on the Moon, get their autographs and/or photos with and spend less than $1,000!

You can buy all kinds of autographs - singers, athletes, film stars, politicians. The list is almost endless, but if you buy a Moonwalker's autograph then what you have was signed by 1 of only 12 people. That's it. And to get such signed in person makes it that much more special. Maybe it's just me, but I think these astronauts are in a very special and rare club and we all should be very appreciative that some choose to appear in public and sign autographs at all.

posted 08-23-2009 12:48 PM               

People here can complain till the cows come home about the "outrageous" prices the astronauts are charging - but at the end of the day, as Rob said, these 12 men are one of a kind and I too am surprised that their autographs are still so cheap. I feel that it is only when these men are deceased that people will start to realise what a bargain say, Young at $495 or Buzz at $350 really was, even if they thought the fees were crazy at the time... that is the very reason why I am trying to convince myself to start paying these fees.

I was recently looking through some old posts on this site, and there was something that someone said that caught my eye - whilst people think beforehand that an autograph is far too dear for their liking, once they spend the money, all they are left with is the autograph they have always wanted and the money paid is very soon forgotten about.

posted 08-23-2009 08:00 PM               

I really don't understand how or why our focus has strayed so far from the topic - space exploration. It seems that lately we spend more time worrying about the astronaut's fees and how much he donates to charity then subject itself.

Rob, you are 100% correct.

And I think as historians, history buffs or collectors, professional or amateur, we should appreciate the opportunities we have to interact with these men while we can.

posted 08-24-2009 11:00 AM               

I have never felt that it was my business how much of the signature fees go to the ASF. I always felt the time they donated was enough. How much if any of the fee they chose to donate was up to them and of no concern of mine. If the astronauts did not donate their time, how many of us would attend?

Personally I never dreamed I would be able to meet any of the astronauts and I am glad for the opportunity. While I have purchased autographs from dealers, I prefer to have the items signed in person, because for me, the experience of meeting them makes it worth the price.

posted 08-24-2009 11:46 AM               

quote:

---

Originally posted by freshspot:
Those of you who disparage astronauts for not donating enough please call the ASF today and upgrade to a Platinum pass. Or just forgo one Buzz autograph and instead write a check to ASF for $350. Go ahead, I dare you. Seems different when looked at the other way, doesn't it?

---

As for the above, it is not a correct analogy. Asking a working person to pony up an extra $350/ticket is not the same as asking a multi-millionaire former astronaut to drop his weekend take at an autograph show.

Years ago these guys signed for free (after they left govt. employment) and now few if any don't. They charge ridiculous fees which people line up to pay. Who's the fool?

What used to be a hobby is now big business and everyone is looking for the buck. It reflects poorly on the astronaut (very poorly on some of them) and reflects poorly on the collector and dealer.

posted 08-24-2009 01:09 PM               

quote:

---

Originally posted by jimsz:
Asking a working person to pony up an extra $350/ticket is not the same as asking a multi-millionaire former astronaut to drop his weekend take at an autograph show.

---

posted 08-24-2009 02:44 PM               

There are thousands of details to look after, both large and small, all of them important. Time is an enemy and Murphy's Law always applies.

I was lucky that I had a trusted group of very experienced a reliable people to work with me to make sure things went smoothly. But there are always issues to deal with usually at the last minute. Whether it be suppliers who failed to do what they were contracted to do, or sales representatives who promised things they could not deliver on. Food caterers who underestimated the amount of food required. Or alcohol suppliers who tried to pad their bills.

Weather, transportation, show space, technical glitches and the worst enemy of all, the human ego, I have found all come to play when putting a large show together.

There are always things that will go wrong, so long as they can be looked after quickly and effectively and most important, are not allowed to harm the experience of those attending, that is all that matters.

I found large shows fun to put together, but they require many many hours of hard work to plan, set up, operate and take down and pay for. Stress levels are high and when they are over you say 'Never again."

Until the next one.

posted 08-24-2009 02:55 PM               

quote:

---

Originally posted by jimsz:
What used to be a hobby is now big business and everyone is looking for the buck. It reflects poorly on the astronaut (very poorly on some of them) and reflects poorly on the collector and dealer.

---