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Author
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Topic: [Puckett] Charlie Bell space hardware (2020)
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Robert Pearlman
Editor Posts: 45606
From: Houston, TX
Registered: Nov 1999
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posted 05-11-2020 12:55 PM
   
Puckett Auctions of Muncie, Indiana, will hold the first in a series of sales of space hardware from the Charlie Bell estate on May 23, 2020. This Is the first of over 4,000 items that will be up for auction in the next few months. One owner with over 10,000 square feet of items that have been in storage for 20 years since the original auction Of Charles Bell's estate in 2000. The first sale, hosted by LiveAuctioneers, includes 223 lots spanning the Apollo and space shuttle programs. |
Cozmosis22
Member Posts: 1062
From: Texas * Earth
Registered: Apr 2011
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posted 05-11-2020 01:21 PM
This auction house is located in Indiana. Wondering if the items are still in Florida? |
Robert Pearlman
Editor Posts: 45606
From: Houston, TX
Registered: Nov 1999
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posted 05-11-2020 01:37 PM
The auction listings state "Ships from Muncie, Indiana" but I would suggest confirming that before bidding. Note that Puckett does not offer shipping: Puckett Auctions does not offer shipping. We will work with any shipping company to get items shipped out to you. You as the buyer are responsible for any and all shipping. We prefer local pick up at the item location.We do not provide any packing material, or help loading of items at the location. |
Chuckster01
Member Posts: 1022
From: Orlando, FL
Registered: Jan 2014
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posted 05-11-2020 02:05 PM
A lot of nice items but I see there are quite a few items described as flown with no documentation offered. Just because an item is used does not always denote flown. As I understand it Charles Bell was a hoarder of space hardware both flown and used in testing. I was told he just hated to see anything go to the dump. |
rgarner
Member Posts: 1285
From: Shepperton, United Kingdom
Registered: Mar 2012
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posted 05-11-2020 02:29 PM
I asked for clarity on the flown status of an item and received this very vague reply: We hired an retired Nasa specialist to Identify all the items in the Warehouse He worked on these projects so he used His nolage and part numbers to determine flown and unflown items. So we are selling with the best of our nolage and his. No documented paper work. There are over 4000 items in a 10.000 square foot warehouse that he identified for 3 month's. Thank you |
Robert Pearlman
Editor Posts: 45606
From: Houston, TX
Registered: Nov 1999
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posted 05-11-2020 02:43 PM
I attended the first of the Charlie Bell auctions back in 2000. My recollection is that very few, if any of the items had any associated paperwork. Trying to discern any type of history now, 20 years later — and maybe more importantly for the shuttle hardware, almost a decade after the end of the program, would present a significant challenge. |
Chuckster01
Member Posts: 1022
From: Orlando, FL
Registered: Jan 2014
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posted 05-11-2020 05:33 PM
So in my opinion the correct way to handle that would be to list as probably or possibly flown. I have used that nomenclature for items I was fairly sure flew but had no documentation. |
denali414
Member Posts: 738
From: Raleigh, NC
Registered: Aug 2017
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posted 05-16-2020 08:07 PM
I have never bid in an auction where we need to do the shipping. Can someone explain who to use and roughly the cost? Thanks! |
Guswastheman
Member Posts: 119
From: Gresham, OR
Registered: Apr 2011
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posted 05-16-2020 08:32 PM
I have bid in several auctions where the auction houses do not provide shipping, however all have had shippers they do business with. You have to call or email the shipper with your lot numbers and after payment is received, they will pick up the lots and package and ship. I have found that shipping is always much higher than through RR, ASF or LL auctions. Guess they charge a fee for pick-up, even though the shipping cost is not itemized out. At these auctions, I only bid on items that can be shipped in a USPS Priority Box. I would hate to guess what these larger items would cost to ship. An 8x10" photo cost me $45. |
thisismills
Member Posts: 395
From: Michigan
Registered: Mar 2012
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posted 05-16-2020 10:49 PM
I've used third party shipping a half dozen times for auction houses like these. This shouldn't stop you from bidding, instead adjust for the extra cost in your final budget. I've never had any issues, in fact the shippers are more than happy to pick up the items, pack, and send to you, it's their business model...but as mentioned above, all this comes at a cost.A ballpark of $50-$100 for everyday size/weight items can be pretty common. Larger and heavier items will increase both the postage cost and the amount packaging materials. The overall cost is high because you are basically paying an hourly rate for someone to drive back and forth then carefully pack your item. It is in their best interest that nothing is damaged, which translates to copious use of supplies. Boxes are bigger than they could be, with no shortage of fresh packing paper, bubble wrap, and tape, all charged at a retail rate of course. You will save on the cost of the box if USPS Priority packaging is used but I've found some companies do not offer this service. If you are a stickler for saving every last dollar, an estimate of size and weight of the items is enough to get a quote from each company before making a selection. In some cases, simply picking the shipper geographically closest the auction house will deliver the best bang for your buck. Companies are pretty competitive so your work calling around may only net you $5-$10 savings. After a few experiences, I determined that it wasn't worth putting a ton of time into it, just pick one, pay 'em, and enjoy your item. Plus you'll now have a bunch of bubble wrap to play with! (or future reusable shipping supplies depending on your excitement level) |
denali414
Member Posts: 738
From: Raleigh, NC
Registered: Aug 2017
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posted 05-17-2020 08:18 AM
Thanks for the advice and information, much appreciated! |
Altidude
Member Posts: 77
From:
Registered: Jan 2016
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posted 05-17-2020 04:48 PM
Usually the auction house will give you a list of recommended shippers. I then just email them the lot number, price and my address to 2-3 of the shippers and ask for estimates. Sometimes there can be great discrepancies of the price and the amount of time they can provide you with the estimate. I tend to go with the people who are quickest with the estimate as long as they are not an outlier. Also, always get the insurance.Just because an auction has an in house shipping department, that doesn’t mean they are the best price or most reliable. I had an instance with a very well known and respected auction house in London ship me a fragile object. They charged me a great deal to ship only to have it put in a box with no packing and get to me in a thousand pieces. Was able to get a refund from them only because I was such consistent customer. However, thing same happened in Switzerland and I was just out of luck. Another example is that well known auction house in Paris tried to charge me 7K for shipment of a mirror. When I raised hell about this, they quickly lowered their price to 2K. So, it is always a gamble, but most of the time it works out. Just remember that most of the time they are not trying to screw you, they’re just trying to make a living and have to have some profit. |
Guswastheman
Member Posts: 119
From: Gresham, OR
Registered: Apr 2011
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posted 05-17-2020 06:20 PM
Obviously, I wouldn't let the hassles of finding your own shipper to deter you from bidding on any item you are interested in, I was just wanting to make the point that, usually you will be paying more. As Thisismills points out, you are paying for the pick up service and so finding a shipper close to the auction house should make this fee less. I also agree with Thisismills that when I have used non auction house shippers the packaging has been over done for protection. Just keep in mind that it will most likely be more expensive than what you may be accustomed to through other auctions that do provide shipping. |
SClarkson
Member Posts: 38
From: Fairfield,
Registered: Sep 2012
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posted 05-19-2020 03:49 PM
I had a nice conversation with one of the auctioneers at Puckett. I spoke to Brad, the gentleman who is managing the sale. He confirmed that they have arranged for the local UPS store to come on site and handle shipments. He assured me that the box and prep fees would be normal rates (plus the actual shipping expense). Brad said he will keep on eye on things since he wants to encourage repeat customers for his future Charles Bell auctions. He also said the items are in Florida and will ship from there. He appreciates the feedback he has been receiving and stressed he is describing items as best he can. Having attended the original Bell auctions 20 years ago I will say that some items then and now are obvious what they were used for. Others will take some research to try and document. Good bidding to all. |
space1
Member Posts: 886
From: Danville, Ohio
Registered: Dec 2002
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posted 05-20-2020 04:54 AM
Wow, if all items are in Florida, they really need to make that clear. Because currently the auction pages say, "Ships from Muncie, IN." |
SpaceAholic
Member Posts: 4772
From: Sierra Vista, Arizona
Registered: Nov 1999
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posted 05-20-2020 08:30 AM
Most lots are inaccurately described with "flown," "Apollo," etc., misapplied, unsubstantiated to attract bidding. Lots of items described as flown could not have plausibly left the pad because they are ground support/not a spacecraft component. Whether just sloppy or intentional — caveat emptor. |
mf451
Member Posts: 70
From: NY, NY
Registered: Nov 2014
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posted 05-20-2020 09:23 AM
quote:
Originally posted by space1:
Wow, if all items are in Florida, they really need to make that clear. Because currently the auction pages say, "Ships from Muncie, IN."
Agreed, especially because the auction house says they prefer local pick up! It would be a shock if you purchased expecting to pickup in Indiana and then, nope, all your big, heavy stuff is 1000 miles away. Couple that with, as Scott points out, an egregious overuse of the word "flown", and this whole thing shouts amateur hour (at best...) and buyer beware. |
Ken Havekotte
Member Posts: 3169
From: Merritt Island, Florida, Brevard
Registered: Mar 2001
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posted 05-20-2020 09:31 AM
Having participated in all of the Bell auctions, yes, I certainly agree with Scott, mf451, and others. The ID tags do help a lot, however, during the Bell auctions the majority of the lots that Charlie had owned since the 1960-90's that he had gotten from NASA and Patrick AFB were ground support equipment, backup spares, etc. But the advertised lots of protective suits are not "Apollo Ground Control launch suits and helmets," but rather various SCAPE fuel, propellant, and chemical loading protective garments that include boots, gloves, and helmets. |
SClarkson
Member Posts: 38
From: Fairfield,
Registered: Sep 2012
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posted 05-20-2020 08:00 PM
Additional update on shipping. Brad Puckett has hired a company called Craters & Freighters to handle the shipping. They will take possession of all items after the sale and once they are paid for will ship them out. They can handle single items in a small carton or larger shipments on pallets. More information will be posted about this company prior the sale. |
SClarkson
Member Posts: 38
From: Fairfield,
Registered: Sep 2012
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posted 05-22-2020 04:51 PM
Here is the information Craters & Freighters provided for anyone interested in having them ship items purchased from the Puckett Charlie Bell auction. A reminder that the items are currently in Florida (near Orlando).Please visit our website for contact information or to get a quote. (Let us know you are a winning bidder from the Puckett auction so we can correctly arrange pick up for your item). Telephone number is 407-854-0404 and we are located at 2517 Shader Rd. Suite #3 Orlando, Florida 32804. |
SpaceAholic
Member Posts: 4772
From: Sierra Vista, Arizona
Registered: Nov 1999
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posted 06-10-2020 07:31 AM
Appears Puckett is going for amateur hour round 2 later this week. Abundant comical and mislabeled lot titles/descriptions. |
spaced out
Member Posts: 3147
From: Paris, France
Registered: Aug 2003
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posted 06-11-2020 05:54 AM
Terms like "NASA Apollo Mission" do seem to have been liberally applied to just about every item in the auction — e.g. "NASA Apollo Mission Fluorescent Desk Lamp." |
MadSci
Member Posts: 239
From: Maryland, USA
Registered: Oct 2008
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posted 06-11-2020 02:22 PM
Labels like: "Apollo-Soyuz Lunar Module" are a bit of a give away. |
SClarkson
Member Posts: 38
From: Fairfield,
Registered: Sep 2012
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posted 06-13-2020 06:51 PM
As noted above Puckett Auctions is holding its second sale of space hardware that originated from the Charlie Bell estate. To confirm the sale is Sunday June 14, at 3:00 p.m. EST.A total of 244 lots are offered with many unique items. Some are easily identifiable and some will take some research. And according to Brad Puckett they did the best they could to identify the items using several retired NASA employees to assist them. As with the last sale, the items are in Florida. Shipping will once again be provided by Craters & Freighters who will work with buyers to pack and ship items by the most affordable means available. The sale is on Live Auctioneers and Invaluable. |
davidcwagner
Member Posts: 866
From: Albuquerque, New Mexico
Registered: Jan 2003
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posted 06-15-2020 07:32 PM
Any info on this switch? It looks like a pyrotechnic connector to me. Engraved is: GLENAIR. 67149-8 ME127-0081-0108 871839501 8747, or GLENAIR. G7149-8 M5127-0081-0108 871839501 8747 Five labels from switch to cutoff wire - Label 1: (5OV77WI02P818)
- Label 2: 1J114D20
- Label 3: (577W030)
- Label 4: 03593-EE0971 — the 03593 part is a maybe
- Label 5: 5OV773OP802
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space1
Member Posts: 886
From: Danville, Ohio
Registered: Dec 2002
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posted 06-15-2020 08:13 PM
As you note, it is a connector (not a switch). I don't think we can associate it with any specific system like pyro. It is the general type of connector used on the Space Shuttle. ME127 is a Rockwell spec number. 03953 is the CAGE code for Rockwell, which means they assembled this harness. There appears to be some red paint on the wire, which may indicate that it was flown (possibly marked for removal and to prevent use for a later flight). |
SpaceAholic
Member Posts: 4772
From: Sierra Vista, Arizona
Registered: Nov 1999
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posted 06-15-2020 08:47 PM
The red paint in an indication the component was scrapped, possibly installed, not necessarily flown or just out of serviced for a multitude of reasons. |
SClarkson
Member Posts: 38
From: Fairfield,
Registered: Sep 2012
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posted 06-28-2020 07:55 PM
The 3rd Space Hardware auction by Puckett Auctions will be held Sunday, July 5, 2020 at 8:00 p.m. EDT. This is a continuation of the Charlie Bell NASA/aviation artifacts sale. Several more will follow. Like the first two sales there are many diverse items. Some very obvious and many that take your imagination and/or research. The items are in Florida and shipping will once again be handled by Craters and Freighters. The sale is on Live Auctioneers and Invaluable (link to come). |
SpaceAholic
Member Posts: 4772
From: Sierra Vista, Arizona
Registered: Nov 1999
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posted 06-29-2020 12:11 AM
quote:
Originally posted by SClarkson:
Like the first two sales there are many diverse items. Some very obvious and many that take your imagination and/or research.
Why does Puckett insist on making declarative title and descriptive statements in its lotting if there are obvious doubts regarding provenance and an expectation that additional research is required? There is nothing wrong with an auction house stating that an items application, provenance is undetermined but that is not what is occurring here. |
SClarkson
Member Posts: 38
From: Fairfield,
Registered: Sep 2012
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posted 07-25-2020 08:43 AM
The 4th Space Hardware auction by Puckett Auctions will be held Sunday, July 26, 2020 at 5:00 p.m. EDT. This is a continuation of the Charlie Bell NASA/aviation artifacts sale. Several more will follow.The sale is on Live Auctioneers and Invaluable. |
denali414
Member Posts: 738
From: Raleigh, NC
Registered: Aug 2017
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posted 08-16-2020 04:18 PM
The next segment of these auctions is going on now, Sunday Aug. 16th, at 5 p.m. on Invaluable. |
space1
Member Posts: 886
From: Danville, Ohio
Registered: Dec 2002
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posted 08-16-2020 05:39 PM
You would think they would try to publicize these in advance. |
denali414
Member Posts: 738
From: Raleigh, NC
Registered: Aug 2017
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posted 08-17-2020 05:18 AM
Some real good bargains last night. Think fatigue probably hitting by 5th auction. |
SpaceAholic
Member Posts: 4772
From: Sierra Vista, Arizona
Registered: Nov 1999
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posted 08-17-2020 08:05 AM
Perhaps more the realization that what is predominately being offered in these auctions is insignificant flotsam and jetsam. |
denali414
Member Posts: 738
From: Raleigh, NC
Registered: Aug 2017
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posted 08-18-2020 12:23 PM
That may be true, but always remember, "one man's junk is another man's treasure." |
Rick Mulheirn
Member Posts: 4311
From: England
Registered: Feb 2001
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posted 08-18-2020 01:46 PM
"Apollo" treasure, don't forget...  |
Robert Pearlman
Editor Posts: 45606
From: Houston, TX
Registered: Nov 1999
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posted 08-18-2020 02:03 PM
I have now heard from several readers who have purchased items at these auctions and have then submitted Freedom of Information Act (FOIA) requests to NASA for more information on the hardware based on part and serial numbers.Already hindered by COVID shutdowns, the replies that have been received have been that no further information is available (as should be expected, given any such records for Apollo and shuttle-era hardware now reside in the National Archives, if anywhere, and not in NASA's holdings). Suffice to say, if people are bidding on these auctions hoping to discover a hidden gem (or just more information) by FOIA, it is not likely going to be successful. |
SpaceAholic
Member Posts: 4772
From: Sierra Vista, Arizona
Registered: Nov 1999
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posted 08-29-2020 08:41 AM
More nonsense from apparently the same source leveraging a different venue. Not even space program affiliated. |
stsmithva
Member Posts: 1995
From: Fairfax, VA
Registered: Feb 2007
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posted 08-29-2020 09:48 AM
It's DOUBLE space program affiliated: "SPACE SHUTTLE APOLLO MISSION"! |
SClarkson
Member Posts: 38
From: Fairfield,
Registered: Sep 2012
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posted 09-04-2020 07:44 AM
I wanted to let folks know that the next Puckett Auction of Charlie Bell items is this Sunday (Sept 6th) at 5pm. There are always many interesting items as Charlie Bell evidently collected almost anything space and aviation related. unfortunately, as noted throughout this thread there is little or no documentation with these items. just as it was with the first Charlie Bell sale 20 years ago. So to quote Robert Pearlman in his post on 8/18, "Suffice to say, if people are bidding on these auctions hoping to discover a hidden gem (or just more information) by FOIA, it is not likely going to be successful." That said, good luck. |
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