Posts: 179 From: Michigan, USA Registered: Nov 2002
posted 06-28-2016 09:06 AM
I want to hang a framed Earthrise photo and I was wondering what the proper orientation of the photo should be.
Most of the time when you see Earthrise photos the moon is at the bottom with the edge in a horizontal plane and the earth above it. But I have also seen the moon on the right of the photo with the edge in a vertical plane with the Earth on the left.
What would have been the way the Apollo astronauts saw it when they came around the moon? I would like to hang my photo the way the astronauts would have seen it when they were there.
Or is there no proper orientation being there is no up, down, left or right in space?
MrSpace86 Member
Posts: 1618 From: Gardner, KS Registered: Feb 2003
posted 06-28-2016 09:23 AM
I believe it with the moon on the right and the Earth on the left. But I have a 50% chance of being correct.
I am 100% sure it was not with the moon on the bottom and the Earth on top; it sucks that the image was "altered" to make it aesthetically pleasing.
mmmoo Member
Posts: 564 From: London, England Registered: May 2001
posted 06-28-2016 09:45 AM
Here is the original unedited camera roll with thumbnails showing the Earth on the left and moon on the right. Although, they did turn the camera 90 degrees later, also.
spaced out Member
Posts: 3171 From: Paris, France Registered: Aug 2003
posted 06-28-2016 10:21 AM
I believe the photo was taken with the lunar surface on the right and the Earth to the left but... there is no "correct" orientation for the image.
The astronauts in the command module could have been oriented in any direction when taking the photo and the CSM itself could have been oriented in any direction in all three axes as it orbited the moon or indeed spinning gently on one or more of them.
In my opinion choice of how to display the image is arbitrary and only a question of aesthetics.
LM-12 Member
Posts: 3577 From: Ontario, Canada Registered: Oct 2010
posted 06-28-2016 10:28 AM
The Day 4 transcript in the Apollo 8 Flight Journal talks about the photo orientation and how Bill Anders saw it.
YankeeClipper Member
Posts: 632 From: Dublin, Ireland Registered: Mar 2011
Some observations by Bill Anders about the photograph are:
My side window was clear — the rest had some kind of oil scraped on them.
Our objective was not to take pictures of the Earth. “Earthrise” isn’t that good of a picture if you really look at it; it’s not quite in focus. Photographers are probably jealous it was picked as one of the top pictures of the Twentieth Century, but right place, right time!
Anders’ famous “Earthrise” image has, for its entire lifetime in worldwide publication, been printed backward. The error was not discovered until recently, when Goddard Space Flight Center engineers mapping and filming the moon’s surface via satellite attempted to re-create the famous image with high-resolution cameras, but could not duplicate the exact composition of the photograph, even on Apollo 8’s orbit path. A NASA technician in 1968 simply flipped one of the 10 or so 70mm negatives of the scene, Anders believes.
The photograph, to be faithful to the way the Apollo 8 crew actually saw Earth rising over the moon that day, really should be viewed sideways. The spacecraft, in the eyes of astronauts, was coming “around” the moon, not flying over it. But technically, those are earth-centric semantics. In truth, it’s accurate either way, as there’s no real “up” or “down” in the zero gravity of space.
My favorite picture was not Earthrise. It’s one where the Earth is sort of blurry and small.
Posts: 840 From: Marietta GA USA Registered: Dec 1999
posted 06-28-2016 11:25 AM
The Earthrise photo, as displayed in Bill Ander's home, shows the lunar surface on the right and the earth on the left. I think that would be the definitive answer.
MarkRP Member
Posts: 179 From: Michigan, USA Registered: Nov 2002
posted 06-28-2016 10:45 PM
Thanks for all the help. I appreciate it.
Grounded! Member
Posts: 460 From: Bennington, Vermont, USA Registered: Feb 2011
posted 06-29-2016 03:19 AM
It seems to me, that an Earth perspective or orientation would equate to facing the nose of the command module, as would be the astronauts position during liftoff. The orientation of the command module at the moment of "earthrise," and not the astronaut's "floating" position as they looked out the window, would determine the correct orientation of the photograph, i.e. If the nose of the CM was facing in the direction of travel, then the classic picture that we see would be (in my opinion) correct.
Yes, I know there is no up or down in space.
neo1022 Member
Posts: 314 From: Santa Monica, CA Registered: Jun 2013
posted 06-29-2016 06:40 PM
Based on the raw high resolution scans posted online, most of the NASA images need to be flipped 180 degrees horizontally to gain their "true" orientation. You can tell from he shots of the film leads, in which the writing is all backwards.
Of course, I'm assuming the raw shots are direct scans from the film reels, and that the frames with images haven't already been flipped.
Am I thinking about this in the right way?
YankeeClipper Member
Posts: 632 From: Dublin, Ireland Registered: Mar 2011
posted 07-07-2016 06:23 PM
August 23rd, 2016 will be the 50th anniversary of the original "Earthrise" photograph captured by Lunar Orbiter I. Extensive information on the image and its 2008 restoration are available.
L-66-7999 shows the image in a conventional horizontal orientation. This is how, with "the picture of the century" proudly displayed before them, key members of the LOPO team reported the success of Lunar Orbiter I at a press conference in August 1966. Left to right are Oran W. Nicks, director of Lunar and Planetary Programs at NASA headquarters; Floyd Thompson; Cliff Nelson; and Isadore G Recant, the Langley scientist in charge of data handling for the spacecraft. At the podium is the U.S. Geological Survey's Dr. Larry Rowan, the young geologist who helped LOPO identify the most promising landing sites.
This detailed photograph dated December 14 1966 was captioned: Langley Center Director Floyd Thompson shows Ann Kilgore the "picture of the century."
This was the first picture of the earth taken from space, and was also called "the greatest shot taken since the invention of photography."
posted 07-08-2016 01:09 AM
I always thought that it was generally recognised that the Copernicus crater taken by Orbiter 2 in 1966 was the "picture of the century."
posted 07-08-2016 04:37 AM
I asked Jim Lovell to sign my photo with the Moon-right and Earth-left, glad I guessed correctly!
YankeeClipper Member
Posts: 632 From: Dublin, Ireland Registered: Mar 2011
posted 07-08-2016 05:48 AM
quote:Originally posted by moorouge: I always thought that it was generally recognised that the Copernicus crater taken by Orbiter 2 in 1966 was the "picture of the century."
The Lunar Orbiter I 'Earthrise' was obtained three months before the Copernicus crater image, was announced publicly first, and was first hailed as the "picture of the century."
In the Time magazine article of December 9th 1966 Space: A New Look at Copernicus what was actually written was the following:
That photograph of the moon's Crater of Copernicus, said NASA Scientist Martin Swetnick, is "one of the great pictures of the century."
It is no wonder that some writers immediately classified it as the 'Picture of the Year'! [Some, with understandable enthusiasm, even hailed it as the 'Picture of the Century.']
posted 03-11-2017 10:55 AM
I thought cS members would like to see this early Apollo 8 Shell Oil poster, that I found a few years back and just had framed up. It actually has the correct earth rise orientation and mentions it.
Mike Dixon Member
Posts: 1567 From: Kew, Victoria, Australia Registered: May 2003
posted 03-11-2017 04:04 PM
That is superb to be honest... well done mate.
YankeeClipper Member
Posts: 632 From: Dublin, Ireland Registered: Mar 2011
posted 03-11-2017 04:50 PM
Interesting piece and great confirmation of the orientation - thanks for showing it!
MartinAir Member
Posts: 108 From: Registered: Oct 2020
posted 08-26-2021 08:16 PM
Orientation is one (relative) thing, aspect ratio is another. Why NASA chose 8x10 format when the film was 70x70mm square? I'm thinking about printing it on 16x16 to preserve the aspect ratio and maintain 300 dpi resolution.
Captain Apollo Member
Posts: 279 From: UK Registered: Jun 2004
posted 09-09-2021 05:32 AM
Wait — so is the photo still incorrectly flipped in most incarnations?
Blackarrow Member
Posts: 3365 From: Belfast, United Kingdom Registered: Feb 2002
posted 09-09-2021 09:43 AM
I think human eyes prefer to see the "ground" beneath us, whether that is Earth beneath our feet, or a landscape 30,000 feet below our airliner, or the Moon at the bottom of our picture. I completely get it that, to Bill Anders and his crewmates, they were "coming around" the Moon, but translate that into a photograph in the hands of an Earthling standing on terra firma and the natural inclination is to put the lunar "ground" at the bottom of the picture, and Earth "up in the sky" (just like the Moon appears to us whether standing on the ground or flying 30,000 feet above the ground).
The argument that "there is no up or down in space" is best seen when we look at a picture of the Earth-Moon system taken from a departing or returning spacecraft. In that case, it really doesn't matter whether the Moon is "above" the Earth or "off to the side." It isn't the normal "feet on the ground" perspective.
David C Member
Posts: 1289 From: Lausanne Registered: Apr 2012
posted 09-11-2021 04:04 AM
quote:Originally posted by Captain Apollo: Wait — so is the photo still incorrectly flipped in most incarnations?
I disagree. If you zoom in on a high resolution version of the image you’ll see that the land mass visible is West Africa and it is the correct way round. So definitely not flipped.
I have two signed versions of the image displayed, the standard in color, moon at bottom; and the higher resolution black and white, moon to the right.
rlobinske Member
Posts: 173 From: Crawfordville, FL Registered: Oct 2014
posted 09-12-2021 07:12 PM
It is fun considering the CSM was nose down toward the lunar surface with a camera mounted in the left docking window taking mapping photos. Borman was in the left seat and started a rotation that brought the Earthrise into view. Anders took the photo at a position in the CM window where the lunar surface was to his right (and where the ship nose was pointed) and the Earth to his left.
NASA Goddard put out this video for the 45th anniversary of the photo that shows the spacecraft attitude in relation to the lunar surface combined with crew dialog.
CJ Member
Posts: 62 From: Cherry Hill, NJ Registered: Nov 2003
posted 09-12-2021 07:28 PM
There may be many ways to display a photograph. The truly accurate way to display it is exactly as the photographer's eyes saw it when he or she tripped the shutter.
Jurg Bolli Member
Posts: 1099 From: Albuquerque, NM Registered: Nov 2000
posted 09-12-2021 08:23 PM
Thanks for posting the video, it is great!