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Author
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Topic: Remembering the original Gemini 9 crew
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perineau Member Posts: 20 From: FRANCE Registered: Jul 2007
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posted February 28, 2011 02:58 PM
45 years ago, the original crew of Gemini 9, Charles Bassett II and Elliot See Jr. died in a plane crash while on their way to inspect their Gemini capsule. I hope that one day, this crew will be included in the remembrance day organized by NASA for Apollo 1 as well as the Challenger 51L crew and the crew of STS-107. I have sent several emails to NASA on this matter, they have never bothered to reply... |
Delta7 Member Posts: 1057 From: Ossian IN USA Registered: Oct 2007
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posted February 28, 2011 03:15 PM
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Gilbert Member Posts: 825 From: Carrollton, GA USA Registered: Jan 2003
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posted February 28, 2011 03:46 PM
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star51L Member Posts: 108 From: Vilano Beach, FL, USA Registered: Aug 2002
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posted February 28, 2011 03:54 PM
.I always felt Charlie Bassett would have proven to be one of the best astronauts ever chosen. |
jasonelam Member Posts: 364 From: Monticello, KY USA Registered: Mar 2007
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posted February 28, 2011 04:30 PM
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Henk Boshuijer Member Posts: 350 From: Netherlands Registered: May 2007
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posted February 28, 2011 05:19 PM
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MB Member Posts: 74 From: Olmsted Falls, Ohio U.S.A. Registered: Jul 2005
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posted February 28, 2011 05:20 PM
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dabolton Member Posts: 128 From: Round Lake, IL, US Registered: Jan 2009
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posted February 28, 2011 05:22 PM
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onesmallstep Member Posts: 258 From: Staten Island, New York USA Registered: Nov 2007
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posted February 28, 2011 05:24 PM
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Tom Member Posts: 1150 From: New York Registered: Nov 2000
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posted February 28, 2011 06:06 PM
Elliot / Charlie...45 years later, you're still in our thoughts and prayers. |
MikeSpace Member Posts: 280 From: Belmar NJ USA Registered: Oct 2010
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posted February 28, 2011 06:11 PM
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Delta7 Member Posts: 1057 From: Ossian IN USA Registered: Oct 2007
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posted February 28, 2011 06:28 PM
Whenever I fly into Lambert Field as a corporate pilot, I wind up parking very close to the crash site. Last time it was low overcast and snowy, and I couldn't help visualize a T-38 circling by very low and suddenly hitting the afterburners.May God speed always, Elliot and Charlie. |
dtemple Member Posts: 568 From: Longview, Texas, USA Registered: Apr 2000
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posted February 28, 2011 07:57 PM
I have been to Lambert International a few times and have tried to determine which building was struck by the T-38, but without any success. In case I am there again can I see it from the terminal or perhaps on approach/takeoff? |
Fezman92 Member Posts: 874 From: New Jersey, USA Registered: Mar 2010
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posted February 28, 2011 08:00 PM
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micropooz Member Posts: 1147 From: Washington, DC, USA Registered: Apr 2003
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posted February 28, 2011 08:21 PM
When I went to work for McDonnell Douglas in the early 1980's, one of the older guys was showing me through Building 101, which at the time was the assembly line for the Harrier. He pointed out to me where the roof and rafters had been repaired after the Bassett and See crash. It was toward the north end of the building. Building 101 is the large white topped building in the center of this photo. |
dss65 Member Posts: 756 From: Sandpoint, ID, USA Registered: Mar 2003
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posted February 28, 2011 10:17 PM
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GACspaceguy Member Posts: 1075 From: Guyton, GA Registered: Jan 2006
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posted March 01, 2011 12:00 AM
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randy Member Posts: 1115 From: West Jordan, Utah USA Registered: Dec 1999
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posted March 01, 2011 03:07 AM
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history in miniature Member Posts: 378 From: Slatington, PA U.S.A. Registered: Mar 2009
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posted March 01, 2011 05:58 AM
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astro-nut Member Posts: 425 From: washington, Illinois USA Registered: Jan 2006
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posted March 01, 2011 12:23 PM
. Never forgotten!!!
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Henry Heatherbank Member Posts: 116 From: Adelaide, South Australia Registered: Apr 2005
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posted March 01, 2011 02:57 PM
Never forgotten indeed, given the impact this event had on the course of history taken in the remainder of the Gemini and Apollo programs.How history may have been different if See and Bassett had not died on that day. |
Lou Chinal Member Posts: 879 From: Staten Island, NY Registered: Jun 2007
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posted March 01, 2011 04:18 PM
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Jeff Member Posts: 183 From: Fayetteville, NC, USA Registered: May 2009
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posted March 01, 2011 04:46 PM
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cddfspace Member Posts: 596 From: Morris County, NJ, USA Registered: Jan 2006
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posted March 01, 2011 09:30 PM
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Kite Member Posts: 146 From: Northampton UK Registered: Nov 2009
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posted March 02, 2011 02:05 PM
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Delta7 Member Posts: 1057 From: Ossian IN USA Registered: Oct 2007
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posted March 02, 2011 02:24 PM
There's little doubt in my mind that Charlie Bassett would have been one of the 12 men to walk on the moon had he lived. |
ColinBurgess Member Posts: 1432 From: Sydney, Australia Registered: Sep 2003
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posted March 02, 2011 02:44 PM
No doubt at all in my mind. Charlie had already been informed by Deke Slayton that if GT-9 went well he was in line for one of the early Apollo missions, and Slayton felt that he would work well on a crew with Frank Borman and Bill Anders. This of course meant that he may well have flown as senior pilot on Apollo 8. I'm sure he would have then stuck around for a lunar landing mission. He was very highly regarded and respected by his peers, both as a pilot and as a person. |
JohnPaul56 Member Posts: 27 From: Montclair, NJ, USA Registered: Apr 2010
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posted March 02, 2011 07:49 PM
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Scott Member Posts: 3278 From: Houston, TX Registered: May 2001
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posted March 02, 2011 11:13 PM
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LM-12 Member Posts: 399 From: Ontario, Canada Registered: Oct 2010
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posted February 28, 2012 05:51 PM
NASA photo S66-15620 is the original Gemini 9 crew portrait of See and Bassett. The image is dated 01/05/1966.Both the prime (See-Bassett) and backup (Stafford-Cernan) Gemini 9 crews can be seen in photo S66-15622. |
mach3valkyrie Member Posts: 30 From: Albany, Oregon USA Registered: Jul 2006
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posted February 28, 2012 07:10 PM
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jasonelam Member Posts: 364 From: Monticello, KY USA Registered: Mar 2007
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posted February 29, 2012 08:46 PM
I can remember flying into St Louis in January, 1996 and seeing the building they hit right before we landed. It was a really emotional moment, especially when you consider the weather conditions were similar to that bad day 30 years prior.I agree NASA needs to remember February 28th and the memory of See and Bassett in much the same way as they remember 51L, Columbia and Apollo 1. |
LM-12 Member Posts: 399 From: Ontario, Canada Registered: Oct 2010
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posted March 07, 2012 10:24 AM
Chapter 14 in NASA SP-4203 On the Shoulders of Titans: A History of Project Gemini has an account of what happened that day.One bright winter morning, the last day of February 1966, the Gemini IX foursome checked into Ellington Air Force Base, Texas, for flight clearance to St. Louis in two dual-seat T-38 jet aircraft. They planned to spend several days practicing on the rendezvous simulator at the McDonnell plant. At Ellington, the four fliers learned that weather in St. Louis was gloomy: 180-meter overcast, visibility 3 kilometers, rain, and fog, with little change expected. Instrument flight rules would be required. See called the St. Louis air traffic controllers, saying he would see them in a couple of hours. He and Cernan discussed the different runways at Lambert Field in St. Louis. See then climbed into the front seat of one T-38, with Bassett easing into the back seat. Stafford and Cernan got into the other plane. They took off from Ellington at 7:35 a.m. See and Bassett led, with Stafford and Cernan flying wing position. Reaching St. Louis just before 9 o'clock, See radioed the Lambert Field control tower and learned that the overcast had lifted to 240 meters since his earlier call, but the visibility had dropped to 2.4 kilometers. Light snow flurries now mixed with the rain and fog. As the aircraft descended through the overcast, the pilots found themselves too far down the runway to land. See elected to keep the field in sight and he circled to the left underneath the cloud cover. Stafford followed a missed approach procedure and climbed straight ahead into the soup to 600 meters, intending to make another instrument approach. He landed safely on his next attempt. Meanwhile, See had continued his left turn. The aircraft angled toward McDonnell Building 101, where technicians were working on the very spacecraft See and Bassett were scheduled to fly. Apparently recognizing that his sink rate was too high, See cut in his afterburners and attempted a sharp right turn; but it was too late. The aircraft struck the roof of the building and crashed into a courtyard. Both pilots were killed. NASA named a seven-man board to investigate the accident. Led by Astronaut Alan B. Shepard, Jr.,* the board looked into all aspects of the tragedy - aircraft maintenance, pilot experience, medical histories, and weather conditions. Shepard's group listened to testimony from everyone who had anything to say, sifted the wreckage for clues, and drew conclusions. They found nothing wrong with the aircraft; it had functioned properly to the moment of impact. Within the past six months, See and Bassett had renewed their instrument flying certificates. Before and during the flight, both men had been in good physical and mental condition, as attested by medical examinations and by reported pre- and in-flight conversations. Furthermore, See was reputed to be an excellent test pilot. Careful, judicious, and technically competent, he should never have crashed at all. Weather appeared to have been the major contributing cause, and pilot error prompted by a desire not to lose sight of the field had carried them too low. On Wednesday, 2 March 1966, Spacecraft No. 9, on its way to the flight dock for shipment to Cape Kennedy, passed an American flag flying at half-mast at the McDonnell plant. The next day, Elliot See and Charles Bassett, attended by their fellow astronauts, were buried in Arlington National Cemetery across the Potomac from the Nation's capital. NASA assigned the Gemini IX prime crew positions to Stafford and Cernan, marking the first time in the agency's manned space flight history that a backup crew had taken over a mission. On 21 March James Lovell and Edwin Aldrin were given the backup duties. There would be no delay in the launch schedule. |
garymilgrom Member Posts: 1113 From: Atlanta, GA, USA Registered: Feb 2007
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posted March 07, 2012 12:57 PM
With all due respect - NASA memorials seem to be for accidents where equipment failed and astronauts died as a result.This accident was the result of a poor decision by Mr. See. Mr. Stafford, faced with the same situation, made a different decision and lived to visit the moon. I don't think this tragedy falls into the same category as those that befell Apollo 1, STS-51L or STS-107. Just my opinion. |
LM-12 Member Posts: 399 From: Ontario, Canada Registered: Oct 2010
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posted March 07, 2012 06:39 PM
The KSC Astronaut Memorial also honours See, Bassett, Freeman, Williams, Carter, Adams and Lawrence. |
ilbasso Member Posts: 1303 From: Greensboro, NC USA Registered: Feb 2006
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posted March 08, 2012 08:25 AM
I just finished re-reading Gene Cernan's "Last Man on the Moon," in which he said that there were widespread concerns in the astronaut corps about Mr. See's flying abilities before the accident. Everything I've read does make the accident appear to be pilot error.One of the primary reasons the astronauts were given T-38's to fly was to keep them sharp, to put them in situations where their lives were riding on their abilities to make snap decisions when something didn't go as planned. There were no consequences to fouling up in a simulator other than looking bad to one's peers or to management. Screw up in a T-38, though, and you pay the price. It's a shame that two astronauts died, and many workers in the plant were injured, as a result of a bad decision. It's fortunate that Mr. See's plane did not destroy the four Gemini spacecraft being assembled in the plant that day. What would that have done to America's race to the Moon? |
Delta7 Member Posts: 1057 From: Ossian IN USA Registered: Oct 2007
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posted March 08, 2012 10:29 AM
As a long-time professional pilot, from what I've read about the accident it was entirely avoidable and frankly inexcusable. Either deliberately or inadvertently. See allowed his altitude to descend well below circling minimums for that approach, as evidenced by the fact he was forced to pull up AND fire afterburners in a desperate attempt to avoid the obstacle he suddenly became aware of. Standard procedure is to NOT descend below the prescribed circling altitude until you are in a position to do so safely and land; See obviously violated this by a wide margin being BELOW the height of buildings! I always wonder how much Bassett was aware of what See was setting them up for and if he had any role in the decision to "Pour on the coals" and get out of there. It all probably happened so fast so possibly not, at least to it's fullest extent until the last few seconds. Tom Stafford's remark to Gene Cernan as See broke off and began the circling maneuver pretty much sums it up: "What the hell is he doing?!" |
Glint Member Posts: 593 From: New Windsor, Maryland USA Registered: Jan 2004
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posted March 08, 2012 01:28 PM
quote: Originally posted by ilbasso: I just finished re-reading Gene Cernan's "Last Man on the Moon," in which he said that there were widespread concerns in the astronaut corps about Mr. See's flying abilities before the accident.
I admire Gene Cernan and intend no disrespect. But isn't this a little like the pot calling the kettle black? This, of course, is in reference to Cernan's 1971 helicopter crash in which there was "no evidence of any mechanical malfunction." To be fair, Cernan isn't necessarily stating his own opinion. He's simply repeating the opinions, or rumors of opinions, that he once heard. |
ilbasso Member Posts: 1303 From: Greensboro, NC USA Registered: Feb 2006
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posted March 08, 2012 08:09 PM
Cernan owned up to his own stupidity in his chopper crash. Deke Slayton tried to give him a cover story that his engine had quit, but Cernan insisted on taking responsibility for his error in judgment. Cernan also trained as a formation flyer when he was flying off carriers, so I assume his jet skills were pretty sharp. |
LM-12 Member Posts: 399 From: Ontario, Canada Registered: Oct 2010
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posted March 08, 2012 08:25 PM
The NASA biography for Elliot See is here. The NASA biography for Charles Bassett is here. |