Posts: 63
From: UK
Registered: Jul 2001

posted 05-23-2002 04:47 PM               

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Talking with Jerry Carr at Autographica, he told me that he was the Capcom for Apollo 8 who said the famous words "Apollo 8, you're go for translunar injection."

However in Andrew Chaikin's book "Man on the Moon," Mike Collins claims he was the one to say those words.

Anyone out there know for definite who said what on that famous voyage?

Posts: 181
From: Richmond, IN USA
Registered: Jun 2001

posted 05-23-2002 07:59 PM               

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Although this event didn't have the world acclaim that the Apollo 11 lunar landing did, I believe it was one of the greatest events in human history. The first humans to leave the influence of the Earth.

I get cold chills thinking about what it must have been like to see the whole Earth for the first time!!! And that close up of the Moon!!! For these reasons Apollo 8 is one of my favorite.

I have heard of a few conflicting stories on various events of Apollo 8. Wasn't there a dispute as to whether it was Borman or Lovell took the first whole Earth view photo?

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Posts: 1031
From: Leeds, Yorkshire, UK
Registered: Oct 2000

posted 05-24-2002 02:55 AM               

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I believe it was Mike Collins who gave the famous directive 'You are go for TLI.'

Jerry Carr was certainly CAPCOM when Apollo 8 entered lunar orbit as I was discussing it with him at the Autographica dinner!

I also believe after the various claims and counter claims that it was accepted that Bill Anders took the famous 'Earthrise' photo

Michael Light's book 'Full Moon' has the less well known black and white version (the first Earthrise photo taken) and acknowledges Anders as the photographer and states that this is bourne out by on board recordings at the time.

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Posts: 809
From: Cortlandt Manor, NY
Registered: May 2000

posted 05-24-2002 10:13 AM               

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Jim Lovell seems to have spent a number of years needling Frank Borman about the photo. When "Lost Moon" first came out and he visited New York for promoting the book (before the movie Apollo 13 was even in production and when everyone had a good chuckle at the idea of Tom Hanks playing Jim Lovell, including Capt. Lovell who mentioned it), Lovell told the entire audience to tell Frank Borman that they understood that Jim Lovell took that famous photo. For years all three crew members apparently asserted credit for the photo. As Steve and Cliff note, it does appear that time has confirmed that Bill Anders took "the" Earthrise photo. Oddly, I recall a discussion a few years ago (but cannot recall where) that credited Frank Borman with the black and white Earthrise photo.

The words I remember from Apollo 8 are not the go for TLI or orbit, since those burns were the purpose of the mission. Instead, it was the confirmation of orbit, achieving the goal, that has stuck in my mind. "We've got it, we've got it, Apollo 8 now in lunar orbit. There is a cheer in this room; Mission Control Houston now turning over to the voice of Jim Lovell." Credit for those words, as I recall, belongs with Paul Haney. They are right up there with Charlie Duke's comments about a bunch of guys about to turn blue, after the Apollo 11 landing.

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From: Cortlandt Manor, NY
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posted 05-25-2002 11:30 PM               

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Thank you Blackarrow for the source of the reference to Frank Borman taking the black and white photo.

The appropriate capcom became a little muddled for me this evening for the call "You are go for TLI." The documentary "For All Mankind" has someone who is decidedly not Mike Collins stating: "You are go for TLI, you are go for the Moon." (It may well be Jerry Carr, just not sure what he looked like in 1968 and his WSS is one of the few photos I could find immediately). Since the documentary hops around a lot, since the audio does not always coincide with the film and since the small portion shown is not identified as Apollo 8, it might not be the appropriate segment. Additionally, the CD that comes with Apogee's mission report for Apollo 8 does have NASA's own film, "Go for TLI." The clip does show Michael Collins as capcom, but you only hear the comment and cannot see who is making it. What confounded me is that the second half of the quotation, "you are go for the Moon," was not part of the audio. I had thought that this was part of the capcom comment for Apollo 8. Further, Deke Slayton in "Deke" also puts Mike Collins in the capcom seat in MOCR and who passed the word up of "Apollo Eight, you are go for TLI." Best bet appears to be Mike Collins, but I would like to know which mission enjoys "you are go for the Moon" quotation (the HBO series did have the actor for Mike Collins using the line for Apollo 8, but that appears incorrect).

Posts: 1031
From: Leeds, Yorkshire, UK
Registered: Oct 2000

posted 05-26-2002 01:20 PM               

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The film "For All Mankind" seems to be a montage of scenes taken at various stages of the Apollo missions. The audio in some cases as far as I can tell doesn't seem on a couple of occasions (and I can't remember now which offhand)to be the audio for that particular piece of footage.

Mike Collins was certainly CAPCOM for the launch and would still have been in the seat for TLI which came later in the same shift.

Moving on to the discussions regarding "Earthrise," having re-read Chaikin's "A Man On The Moon" I am still curious about the photographer of the B&W photograph. On page 113 (paperback) as the Earth rises Anders calls the crews attention and at this point I assume he photographs it as Borman quips "Hey don't take that it's not scheduled." He then according to the text asks Lovell "Hand me that roll of colour quick, would you?"

Anders then "slapped on the colour magazine and aimed the camera."

Just another "slant" on the story!

Posts: 176
From: Golden, Colorado, USA
Registered: Nov 2006

posted 02-25-2008 04:00 PM            

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I think the question of Mike Collins making the "Go for TLI" is answered.

In the film "In the Shadow of the Moon", Mike states that he is the one who said this and he felt later that he should have said something more grandiose to mark the occasion (I am para-phrasing his statement).

Additionally, for the film, the film makers synced the voice track to the MOCR picture of Mike Collins saying it - proof enough for me.

Posts: 2983
From: Merritt Island, Florida, Brevard
Registered: Mar 2001

posted 02-27-2008 10:13 PM               

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Missed this post before, but to help set the record straight, Jerry Carr was one of the assigned capcoms for Apollo 8 and a member of the astronaut support crew. During our visits together there was never any confusion about Carr's significant role as a mission capcom.

He wasn't the first assigned mission capcom when Apollo 8 was launched to the moon on Dec. 21, 1968. That was indeed Mike Collins, a former or original Apollo 8 prime crew member, that ushered a new era in space travel when he announced almost 2 1/2 hours after liftoff of man's first lunar voyage, "All right, you are go for TLI (Trans Lunar Injection.)" Collins, while not part of the support team, was the first Apollo 8 mission capcom.

Other assigned capcoms were Armstrong, Aldrin, Haise, Mattingly, Carr, and Brand.

What Carr was noted for during his Apollo 8 capcom role on Dec. 24 was a historical phrase in which he said from Mission Control Center in Houston to the crew, "You are Go for LOI (Lunar Orbit Insertion)!" That was just over 68 hours into the flight and the crew still could not see the moon outside their spacecraft windows. As recorded earlier, Carr asked what they could see. "Nothing," Anders replied. "It's like being on the inside of a submarine."

During one of Col. Carr's visits to my home in 2003 he was kind enough to sign and inscribe several of my Apollo 8 photos and postal lunar orbit covers with, "12/24/68 - You are Go for LOI,! (signed) Jerry Carr, Capcom Apollo 8" and with "Jerry Carr, Apollo 8 Capcom & Support Crew 1967-68," and another, "Jerry Carr (signed), Capcom Apollo 8, You are Go for LOI! Dec. 24, 1968."

Before his Skylab assignment and training in 1971, he worked on the support crew for Apollo 12 and served as one of the mission capcoms. Little known about Carr was his long-term astronaut specialty assignment in the development and testing of the lunar roving vehicle.

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posted 03-07-2008 09:37 AM               

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If you go to the special section area in the DVD of "In The Shadow of The Moon," Mike Collins actually is shown on original NASA B&W film footage saying go for TLI on the Apollo 8 mission.

Mike goes on to say that he should have said something more momentous, but that was the language they used as astronauts.

It is a very entertaining outtake interview.