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Author
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Topic: Apollo 11 autographs: Are they real?
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spacekiddo
Member Posts: 33
From: The Netherlands
Registered: Mar 2011
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posted 04-02-2011 11:00 AM
  
Shortly after the Apollo 11 mission, I requested signatures from Neil Armstrong, Buzz Aldrin and Michael Collins. On one occasion I even made a drawing of the flight emblem myself and requested MSC in Houston for the signatures and have it sent back to me. They did...After all these years I'm still not sure if these signatures are real (signed by the astronauts themselves), or done by somebody at the PR of MSC? Anyone has an idea?  |
Robert Pearlman
Editor Posts: 42988
From: Houston, TX
Registered: Nov 1999
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posted 04-02-2011 11:29 AM
Unfortunately, neither set of autographs are authentic; both were signed using a machine called an autopen.Briefly, a secretary or other support staff member at NASA would use the autopen to trace one of several signature patterns per astronaut onto the item to be signed. Any pen could be used, so different ink and tip styles is common. Even with the autopens, I think your cards make a terrific memento of your personal experience witnessing the first lunar landing. |
spacekiddo
Member Posts: 33
From: The Netherlands
Registered: Mar 2011
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posted 04-02-2011 11:33 AM
Robert, I was afraid of that, but back in 1969 being a 15-year old kid, I truly believed that Neil, Buzz and Michael sat down to sign my card... Oh well...What you say is true and I still cherish the collection... I repeated the same procedure with drawing the emblems and requested for autographs after all the Apollo missions and I got them all back signed, except for Apollo 13. Thanks for adding the picture and the reply. |
stsmithva
Member Posts: 1933
From: Fairfax, VA, USA
Registered: Feb 2007
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posted 04-02-2011 12:01 PM
I can understand your disappointment over the Apollo 11 autopens, but that is still a really great memento you made all those years ago. Could you post photos of the other ones you got back signed, for us to see some interesting vintage signed items? (And admire your vintage watercolor skills!) |
MikeSpace
unregistered
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posted 04-02-2011 01:28 PM
I think it's still wonderful!For someone to go to the trouble of drawing the mission patch and sending it in, the fact that it still made the journey through NASA channels and back to you is, I think, very cool. |
george9785
Member Posts: 196
From: Burnaby, BC, Canada
Registered: Nov 2010
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posted 04-02-2011 01:56 PM
With that sort of background, you might actually want to send the item to Buzz and Mike along with a copy of this thread to see whether they'd sign on a complimentary basis - I can see them doing something like that as long as the signing intermediary didn't interfere.If that succeeded, then you might even consider the Holy Grail signing for a completion. Maybe he'd too do it for the sentiment to follow suit. Very unlikely but who knows. |
Robert Pearlman
Editor Posts: 42988
From: Houston, TX
Registered: Nov 1999
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posted 04-02-2011 02:16 PM
Personally, I would suggest against the above idea.I find the charm of your cards is that they were created at the time of the missions. Adding modern day signatures, assuming that was even possible, would take something away from that. Besides, Armstrong and Collins have requested to no longer receive mail, and thus we should respect their wishes. But if you are really set on trying to add authentic signatures by Collins and Aldrin, I would suggest taking part in their commercial signings, sending them their fee, and then let them decide whether to refuse your money (rather than the opposite, having them ask for payment). |
george9785
Member Posts: 196
From: Burnaby, BC, Canada
Registered: Nov 2010
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posted 04-02-2011 02:54 PM
It would have been better for Robert to have provided an opinion a little later rather than sooner - unfortunately, whether he knows it or not, his opinion here will influence other opinions and comments.With the benefit of having included this thread with any such request, the former astronauts would have recognized the purity of how the signatures were originally sought and it would have been a small thing for at least two of the three to momentarily escape the commercial mentality that is associated with the autograph-seeking endeavor (which is very dominant nowadays and which caused Mr. Armstrong to, for all intents and purposes, stop signing) and to gladly sign the item for you. The benefit of having an avid collecting community such as cS that encouraged and prompted you to seek the autographs in this manner would have helped the cause and would certainly have added to the demonstration of good faith and sentimentality that is behind the request. The charm of the item would have continued with your story in that you waited approximately 40 years to inquire about the authenticity of the original signatures and, from there, what might have transpired had you sought to actually obtain authentic autographs in this way with the support and encouragement of the cS community. |
Robert Pearlman
Editor Posts: 42988
From: Houston, TX
Registered: Nov 1999
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posted 04-02-2011 03:19 PM
quote:
Originally posted by george9785:
The benefit of having an avid collecting community such as cS that encouraged and prompted you to seek the autographs in this manner would have helped the cause...
Were it that easy, everyone would be doing it. The fact is, per the astronauts themselves, collectSPACE readers -- some well meaning, some well... not, have been printing out and mailing in threads for almost as long as this forum has existed. I've personally seen copies that have pled sometimes earnest but more often rather exaggerated cases for why they merited a free autograph (or an autograph at all from non-signers). None, to my knowledge, have been successful. But that really wasn't the focus of my advice (and I'm sorry if some feel I should hold my opinion; if it carries any weight, which I would question, it's probably for good reason). I truly feel that the cards are wonderful as they exist now, and need absolutely no enhancing to continue being the treasured personal and (hopefully, eventually) family heirlooms they already are... |
george9785
Member Posts: 196
From: Burnaby, BC, Canada
Registered: Nov 2010
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posted 04-02-2011 03:40 PM
It's unfortunate - while I could counter Robert's last point of view in this particular case, it really wouldn't matter anymore because the thread has been spoiled. |
JasonB
Member Posts: 1091
From:
Registered: Sep 2003
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posted 04-02-2011 05:31 PM
I'm quite certain that the Astronauts, especially the Apollo 11 crew, have heard it all. I doubt that unless they know you personally any story at all would really move them to sign things sent to them by anyone. I guess you should never say never but I doubt this would qualify as a special case, otherwise everyone would be sending stuff to them simply saying "I got this as a kid!". There's no way for them to sort out who's a real space fanatic and who just wants a free autograph. I seriously doubt they are interested in doing that anyway even if they could. It's pretty well established with them now. If you want an autograph, you pay their price.
That being said I think it should be left alone. I mean if it's been that way since you were a kid, adding their autographs now wont bring anything extra to it for you but it will cost a whole lot. You can just as easily get something nicer signed and not potentially spoil or lose something which has a lot of sentimental value for you. |
spacekiddo
Member Posts: 33
From: The Netherlands
Registered: Mar 2011
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posted 04-02-2011 06:40 PM
Thanks everybody for the nice replies...Personally I think that I shouldn't ask the former astronauts again for "real" signatures... I should leave it the way it is, with all the nice memories in making these cards and eagerly waiting to get them back. I scanned all my other signature cards and attach them to this message. As mentioned before, the only card that didn't come back was Apollo 13. Instead a got a crew photo back, from which I cut the signatures and glued them on a self made emblem card. I also include a photo – with a probably real signature of Don Slayton. Kind of tribute to the man who got a second chance in Apollo-Soyuz. |
spacekiddo
Member Posts: 33
From: The Netherlands
Registered: Mar 2011
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posted 04-02-2011 06:53 PM
 
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spacekiddo
Member Posts: 33
From: The Netherlands
Registered: Mar 2011
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posted 04-02-2011 06:55 PM
 
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Robert Pearlman
Editor Posts: 42988
From: Houston, TX
Registered: Nov 1999
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posted 04-02-2011 06:57 PM
quote:
Originally posted by spacekiddo:
I also include a photo – with a probably real signature of Don Slayton.
Indeed, it's authentic... as are the Apollo 17 crew signatures on your emblem card. |
astrobock
Member Posts: 138
From: WV, USA
Registered: Sep 2006
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posted 04-02-2011 07:57 PM
These are all fantastic just the way they are. Thank you for sharing them with us. |
stsmithva
Member Posts: 1933
From: Fairfax, VA, USA
Registered: Feb 2007
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posted 04-02-2011 09:58 PM
quote:
Originally posted by george9785:
It's unfortunate - while I could counter Robert's last point of view in this particular case, it really wouldn't matter anymore because the thread has been spoiled.
I don't think that Robert's comment "spoiled" this thread - that is, decreased the possibility that Aldrin or Collins, upon reading about the autopens, would have decided to sign it for free. Robert was just giving an assessment based on the facts as observed in the last few years. They probably get at least one such request every day of their lives, and they know that unfortunately a lot of them (unlike this one) are from people just trying to make a quick buck. Let's put it this way: I can think of a couple of reasons why an autograph request I could send to Neil Armstrong might stand out from most. But if I asked about the chances for success here and Robert was the first to say "probably not", he wouldn't have spoiled the thread. Moot point since spacekiddo has said he wouldn't want to add modern autographs to it. I think he should think about framing a nice 8x10 of the moon with the cards arranged around it. Keeping them safe in an album is OK, but that would be a fun, nostalgic display. |
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