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Author
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Topic: Armstrong's autograph: good investment?
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2003hdannv
Member Posts: 231
From: Cape Coral, Florida USA
Registered: Mar 2004
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posted 10-18-2009 03:27 PM
   
I have been collecting autographs, prints and flown flags and flown Beta cloths for about seven years. I am trying to diversify my collection and was talking with others and they recommend that I should direct my focus on Armstrong and Apollo 11 items. Would you go this route and slim out the other moonwalkers? Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated. |
capoetc
Member Posts: 2169
From: McKinney TX (USA)
Registered: Aug 2005
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posted 10-18-2009 04:55 PM
The following contains my opinions only... The question is, are you trying to invest in space collectibles to make a bunch of money or for retirement? If so, my advice would be to not do that. There are many other investments that are likely to outperform "Apollo 11 futures" over the long run. It would be wise to collect what you like, keeping within a reasonable budget, and invest somewhere else... equities, real estate, etc, preferably with a diversified portfolio. ------------------
John Capobianco
Camden DE |
xlsteve
Member Posts: 391
From: Holbrook MA, USA
Registered: Jul 2008
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posted 10-19-2009 09:44 AM
I agree. As someone who works in financial services I know the temptation given the recent market is to invest in something more substantial than traditional investments, but collectibles of any kind are very risky.That said, I don't see a signed Armstrong piece with good provenance going down in value in the future, but I would hope that would be a secondary consideration. I know that given the expense of acquiring one you certainly do not want to lose money. If you are buying what you enjoy and can afford, then you should be okay. If you decide to sell later on and make money - that's a bonus. |
Hart Sastrowardoyo
Member Posts: 3445
From: Toms River, NJ
Registered: Aug 2000
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posted 10-19-2009 12:12 PM
I'll have to agree. I hated parting with a lot of my space collection over the past years, but in the end came out ahead. With the economy the way it is, people are looking to unload stuff and just not getting the money they think they should.There's one auctioneer which I see routinely puts a high number as the opening bid for astronaut autographs - even for someone as accessible (and let's face it, doesn't have a name value) like Cenker. But just because they're asking it doesn't mean they'll get it. Collect what you'll like is also sage advice. By doing that, you'll be a little bit more knowledgeable about your item and thus be a little more informed as to its true value should you decide to sell it later on. I could collect rookie baseball cards, for example, but wouldn't have a clue whether selling one for $100 is a bargain to the buyer or if I overpriced it. |
2003hdannv
Member Posts: 231
From: Cape Coral, Florida USA
Registered: Mar 2004
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posted 10-19-2009 12:37 PM
Thanks to all for your valuable information. |
JasonIUP
Member Posts: 282
From: PA
Registered: Apr 2004
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posted 10-20-2009 10:26 PM
Look at Armstrong selling prices ten years ago compared to now. The comparison must involved the same item (unpersonalized 3x5, personalized WSS photo, etc.). Assuming he doesn't start signing again, let the price differences determine whether or not he's a good investment. There's no opinion there - just results! |
capoetc
Member Posts: 2169
From: McKinney TX (USA)
Registered: Aug 2005
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posted 10-21-2009 06:56 AM
Using that argument, you should invest heavily in gold. Look at the prices ten years ago compared to now. It can only continue to go up, right?------------------
John Capobianco
Camden DE |
xlsteve
Member Posts: 391
From: Holbrook MA, USA
Registered: Jul 2008
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posted 10-21-2009 07:48 AM
Hey, gold as an investment was seeing a big comeback this time last year and early this year when market kept tanking. As well as all those 'cash for gold' schemes. Not a recommendation, just an observation. I guess if civilization collapses, gold would hold it's value better than an unpersonalized Armstrong WSS. |
Hart Sastrowardoyo
Member Posts: 3445
From: Toms River, NJ
Registered: Aug 2000
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posted 10-21-2009 08:49 AM
quote:
Originally posted by capoetc:
Using that argument, you should invest heavily in gold.
Actually, using that argument, I'm going to buy an abandoned service station and fill its tanks with gasoline and just sit on it for ten years. And if civilization collapses, everybody will be coming to me. 
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Hart Sastrowardoyo
Member Posts: 3445
From: Toms River, NJ
Registered: Aug 2000
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posted 10-21-2009 08:57 AM
On a serious note though, collectibles are worth only what someone else is willing to pay for it. The same could be said for metals - at one point in the 1850s, aluminum was worth more than gold in California - but you will find a somewhat consistent worth and value inherent in metals. An Armstrong WSS, or any other signed collectible, is worth nothing to someone who has no interest in it. (I once sold a collection of 700 or so signed photos [non-astronaut] for $125, which was the best I could get. That worked out to a little over $5 a photo, or the cost of just the photo - not the cost of signatures, or of attending signing shows.) |
2003hdannv
Member Posts: 231
From: Cape Coral, Florida USA
Registered: Mar 2004
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posted 10-21-2009 09:36 AM
I understand everyone's side to this but my main focus was should I let go of all of the other astronauts photos that I collected and just focus on Armstrong and of course keep a WSS Collins and a couple of Aldrins. It just seems to me in all of the auctions that I have been following Armstrong still demands more than the other moonwalkers. |
Robert Pearlman
Editor Posts: 42988
From: Houston, TX
Registered: Nov 1999
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posted 10-21-2009 09:46 AM
Why is it that you originally collected those other astronauts' autographs, to make money by eventually selling them or because you admired their accomplishments? If the latter, than it shouldn't matter how much (or how little) their signatures sell for today in comparison to others. In other words, as John wrote earlier, collect what you like... |
Hart Sastrowardoyo
Member Posts: 3445
From: Toms River, NJ
Registered: Aug 2000
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posted 10-21-2009 10:56 AM
quote:
Originally posted by 2003hdannv:
It just seems to me in all of the auctions that I have been following Armstrong still demands more than the other moonwalkers.
I would say no. Who's to say that on his passing, Armstrong's estate is not going to have a cache of a thousand signed photos that they'll release with a COA also signed by Armstrong, along with the caveat, "This is definitely the real deal, from Armstrong himself. The others, you can't be sure." Then all of the other sudden, his autograph isn't worth as much from places other than his estate. (It's certainly what I would do.)Again, collect what you like. If it appreciates in value, great. Or try selling one of your high-end autographs and see what you realize matches what your expectations are. |
JasonIUP
Member Posts: 282
From: PA
Registered: Apr 2004
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posted 10-21-2009 03:00 PM
Armstrong's estate selling a plethora of signed items is a possibility. But, citing his feelings about selling autographs, it seems unlikely. I think it's very easy to buy based on what you like AND investment potential. No one tries to pay more for an autograph than it will be worth in the future, I assume. |
DSeuss5490
Member Posts: 299
From: Columbus, Ohio USA
Registered: Jan 2003
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posted 10-21-2009 03:39 PM
Regardless of whether or not Armstrong has a stash, the day will come when many of those with multiple Armstrongs will be sending them to auction all at the same time. While there is the possibility of an immediate jump in price I think it is more than likely that there could be significant decreases after that. Armstrong was an easy signature to obtain at one time and even when he became more difficult through the mail you could still pick one up from a dealer for about $100-$250. I picked up a lot of 10 Armstrong WSS photos (with 8 being uninscribed)at a UACC auction in 1986 for an average of $58.00 each. The prices these days just don't make any logical sense. When you compare the historical worthiness and collectability of Armstrong's signature to that of other notables within the same elite category, I would think that $1500-$2000 would be a fair value for an Armstrong WSS photo given the demand and quantity available. Just my opinion. I do think that the unusual and unique, such as that check that sold at R&R recently, will hold their own in terms of value in the future. |
SpaceSteve
Member Posts: 428
From: San Antonio TX, USA
Registered: Apr 2004
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posted 10-21-2009 03:55 PM
Wasn't it just last year that a Neil Armstrong uninscribed WSS sold in a Heritage Auction for over $7,500 (and a few others selling for other high amounts)?I don't remember any other Armstrong uninscribed WSS's approaching that figure since then. Also, inscribed WSS's were approaching/exceeding $2,000 each. Now, they're struggling to approach $1,500 each. It appears that we have seen, or are seeing a retreat in prices, for whatever reason. Will prices fall further? Just something to keep in mind... |
Michael
Member Posts: 309
From: Brooklyn New York
Registered: Jun 2002
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posted 10-21-2009 06:37 PM
That would be a great way for Neil to get even with the autograph collectors, by having a few thousand ready to go. That would make the prices drop. He would have the last laugh and you know what they say about people who have the last laugh. I wonder if Neil ever reads this site and wonder what he thinks.
I also remember the prices of Neil WSS uninscribed go for 5-7000 and now I see them go for 3-4000 in the last Superior and R&R auction. The market is over saturated with autographs. Just try selling one, the auction houses make all the money, not the collector. Oh well, I guess we will find out in ten years. |
Hart Sastrowardoyo
Member Posts: 3445
From: Toms River, NJ
Registered: Aug 2000
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posted 10-21-2009 07:51 PM
Well, it may not be a way to get even, but my idea of having a stash does make sense (if to me.) Just think about it: we've seen items from Slayton's estate come on the market. We've seen astronauts that normally don't sign, sign - with one key exception. What better way to provide for your family when you pass on when you have a stash with impeccable provenance?And yes, prices do go up but then fall after a supply of items come on the market. While not an astronaut, I do remember that after Scott Bakula did his book signing did prices for his autograph not only fall, but many fakes came off the market - because people knew that by and large, a good signature was in a book, not on a photo. |
yeknom-ecaps
Member Posts: 660
From: Northville MI USA
Registered: Aug 2005
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posted 10-21-2009 08:51 PM
Have to also keep in mind the impact of time and inflation - even for someone like Dick Scobee of the Challenger crew still can be bought for $25-$30 today, not much more than the $15-$20 before his death. Others shuttle astronauts are in the $15-$20 range now which were $10-$15 range in the 1980's - would have lost money compared to inflation. M-G-A especially A-11 astronauts will command a premium but as an investment not sure I'd go for it. |
Tykeanaut
Member Posts: 2212
From: Worcestershire, England, UK.
Registered: Apr 2008
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posted 10-22-2009 02:48 PM
I can understand Armstrong not liking profiteering and he obviously doesn't need the money. But why not sign and sell your autograph for a charities funds? Then at least some good would come from it. |
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