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Author
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Topic: STS-51L crew-issued and flown mission patches
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Kevin T. Randall
Member Posts: 425
From: High Wycombe, Bucks UK
Registered: Dec 2008
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posted 11-12-2012 01:13 PM
   
For the first time, (as far as I know), the family of a member of the ill fated STS-51L Challenger crew had listed for sale, three examples out of the seven pre-flight crew issued mission patches they had. It was the family of Judy Resnik.These patches differ from the common souvenir versions of this patch by the fact that AB Emblem used a 'white' twill backing instead of the common 'grey' twill one.
The front and back images of one of these patches on the auction sales page, shows the main body of the patch with a 'grey' twill backing, but the sew on tab has a 'white' twill backing. The only known example of a totaly 'white' twill backing is from a patch recovered from the 'Official Flight Kit' container along with a 'flown' U.S. flag. These now make up a presentation piece which can be seen at the Smithsonian Inst. museum in Washington DC. The three patches from this listing are now on their way to an address in Alabama, where they will be re-directed to the United Kingdom and France. When they arrive in Alabama we will find out if all three patches are identical or differ in respect of the backing twill type / colour on the main body and sew on tab for each patch. |
garyd2831
Member Posts: 324
From: Syracuse, New York, USA
Registered: Oct 2009
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posted 11-12-2012 01:28 PM
I would have love to have added one to my STS-51L collection. I have a STS-51L patch that is signed by Greg Jarvis. |
Robert Pearlman
Editor Posts: 26066
From: Houston, TX
Registered: Nov 1999
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posted 11-12-2012 02:12 PM
quote:
Originally posted by Kevin T. Randall:
...the family of a member of the ill fated STS-51L Challenger crew had listed for sale
Did a family member sell them or was it a friend of a family member? The description says: These patches were given to my brother by the Resnik family... Just asking if perhaps you learned more through your e-mail contact with the seller. |
Kevin T. Randall
Member Posts: 425
From: High Wycombe, Bucks UK
Registered: Dec 2008
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posted 11-12-2012 02:53 PM
Yes Robert, I spent over four hours last night between 19:30pm GMT to past midnight e-mailling backwards and forwards with the seller trying to establish what these patches were, and whether they are all identical or not. I still don't know for sure even now.
Yes, the seller is related to the family through marrage and came by these three patches, (plus another which he is keeping), through the death of another family member, his brother, who was marred to Judy's sister. He only came by four patches, the other three are with another family member who is not very happy that the patches were even listed, let alone sold for the prices I bought them for. (This sale has caused a family problem). |
Gonzo
Member Posts: 262
From: Lansing, MI, USA
Registered: Mar 2012
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posted 11-13-2012 11:25 AM
Kevin - did you get all three for that price? Also, and this is just my opinion, delete it if needed, but considering that this sale has caused a family issue and the significance of these patches is indisputable, I think I'd consider returning them if that is what the family would want. Yes, I agree that they are definitely unique to a collector, but some things should stay as they are. Again, just my opinion. |
Kevin T. Randall
Member Posts: 425
From: High Wycombe, Bucks UK
Registered: Dec 2008
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posted 11-13-2012 12:18 PM
The first two cost me just $19.99 each, the third I bought for Chris Spain, (Spaced out), at his request, as he found himself barred from bidding or Buying It Now, that will cost him $39.99, or an exchange of patches.Returning these patches has crossed my mind, but the potential value of these patches both historically and monetary has made me think twice. If I was asked by the Resnik family, (Judy's sister Linda, the original owner), then yes, I probably would return the two I have bought. The third I would have to leave up to Chris to decide on. |
Gonzo
Member Posts: 262
From: Lansing, MI, USA
Registered: Mar 2012
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posted 11-13-2012 12:51 PM
Thanks, Kevin, for the response. And that is exactly what I was referring to - these particular patches are important historically. Considering that importance, I'd return them if that's what they want, but it's entirely up to them. |
garyd2831
Member Posts: 324
From: Syracuse, New York, USA
Registered: Oct 2009
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posted 11-13-2012 01:01 PM
Is the any record to as to how many patches and flags that were flown on STS-51L and how many were recovered? |
Robert Pearlman
Editor Posts: 26066
From: Houston, TX
Registered: Nov 1999
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posted 11-13-2012 01:26 PM
To the best of my knowledge, most, if not all, of the STS-51L Official Flight Kit and personal preference kits were recovered intact, still inside the lockers where they were stowed. The patches, like most of the individual items were sealed in plastic pouches.NASA said it would return the OFK items to their respective organizations and that the PPK contents would be given to the family members. The agency also said that each state would be presented with a patch and flag that was stowed on Challenger for its ill-fated flight. There were at least 1,000 patches and more than 2,000 flags aboard. If I recall correctly, at least one package of 25 crew patches did separate from the cabin and was later found floating off the shore in New England. The patches were recovered, still sealed in plastic, and returned to NASA. |
Kevin T. Randall
Member Posts: 425
From: High Wycombe, Bucks UK
Registered: Dec 2008
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posted 11-13-2012 01:36 PM
quote:
Originally posted by garyd2831:
Is the any record to as to how many patches and flags that were flown on STS-51L and how many were recovered?
Yes probably, but I don't know how to access that information.As far as I know the 'Official Flight Kit' was recovered as one patch and one flag was removed to make up one presentation piece which now can be seen in the Smithsonian Inst. Museum in Washington DC. This presentation piece can also be seen on crewpatches.com STS-51L page. The 'Official Flight Kit' is currently with what is left of the Challenger at Cape Canaveral Air Force Base. |
Robert Pearlman
Editor Posts: 26066
From: Houston, TX
Registered: Nov 1999
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posted 11-13-2012 01:44 PM
quote:
Originally posted by Kevin T. Randall:
The 'Official Flight Kit' is currently with what is left of the Challenger at Cape Canaveral Air Force Base.
As noted above, the OFK and PPK contents were not interred with the Challenger wreckage, according to news reports at the time. The items were returned to their owners and the family members.For example, a large U.S. flag that was flown for a Boy Scouts troop was returned to them, and they now fly it on special occasions (Mitt Romney cited this flag in one of his campaign speeches). There are additional STS-51L flown flag and patch displays around the nation, including one at the Frontiers of Flight Museum in Dallas, Texas. I believe another is on display in the Reagan Library in California. On edit: Here's another, Ohio's display as exhibited at the Armstrong Air and Space Museum. And New York's is on display at the Cradle of Aviation in Garden City. |
Kevin T. Randall
Member Posts: 425
From: High Wycombe, Bucks UK
Registered: Dec 2008
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posted 11-13-2012 01:52 PM
I stand corrected Robert. |
Robert Pearlman
Editor Posts: 26066
From: Houston, TX
Registered: Nov 1999
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posted 11-13-2012 02:07 PM
Exploring this a bit through Google, I've accounted for the following STS-51L flown patch and flag displays: - California: Ronald Reagan Presidential Library, Simi Valley
- New Mexico: Museum of Space History, Alamogordo
- New York: Cradle of Aviation, Garden City
- South Carolina: State Museum, Columbia
- Texas: Frontiers of Flight Museum, Dallas
- Smithsonian: National Air and Space Museum
- Onizuka Air Force Station, Calif. (a flown STS-51L patch, Air Force Satellite Control Facility patch and a large U.S. flag were on presented by NASA to the base and displayed there until its closure in 2010; current location, unknown.)
I'll add to this as I or others find additional displays... |
spaced out
Member Posts: 2533
From: Paris, France
Registered: Aug 2003
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posted 11-14-2012 01:52 AM
When Kevin contacted me about this listing the only thing I had to go on was that they were originally a gift from the Resnik family. I don't think the original listing gives any hint of family conflict or any reason to hesitate when buying an example. Kevin kindly bought the third patch on my behalf, as I was blocked.I should point out that right now we don't even know if more than one of these three patches is actually of the scarce white backing cloth variety. I also see no reason to assume at this point that these patches were recovered flown examples. We've seen examples of STS-51L patches that came from crew members in the past (Dick Scobee's patches) although these appear to have been gray backing cloth versions. I don't believe that all the white versions went into the OFK so it wouldn't be surprising to see crew family/friend examples of this patch. |
Kevin T. Randall
Member Posts: 425
From: High Wycombe, Bucks UK
Registered: Dec 2008
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posted 11-17-2012 03:45 AM
I now have very good images of these three STS-51L 'Resnik' pre-flight issued patches, both the fronts and backs. All three patches are basically the same, with a 'grey' twill main body, and a 'white' twill sew on tab. (Though the top patch has a thicker, whiter plastic coated back, and a slightly different coloured grey border).  
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Kevin T. Randall
Member Posts: 425
From: High Wycombe, Bucks UK
Registered: Dec 2008
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posted 12-17-2012 01:26 PM
The fourth one of these patches had just been listed and sold within 25 minuets at a start price of $199.00 and a Buy It Now of $250.00.It was sold to a member of this forum. The patch shown on the listing is the middle patch shown above, not the one the buyer will receive. I currently have the top and bottom patches, they are slightly different in that the grey thread around the border of the main body are two different shades of grey. |
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