Space News
space history and artifacts articles

Messages
space history discussion forums

Sightings
worldwide astronaut appearances

Resources
selected space history documents

Websites
related space history websites

  collectSPACE: Messages
  Patches & Pins
  Space Station payload ops, increment patches

Post New Topic  Post A Reply
profile | register | preferences | faq | search

next newest topic | next oldest topic
Author Topic:   Space Station payload ops, increment patches
JBoe
Member

Posts: 900
From: Churchton, MD
Registered: Oct 2012

posted 12-13-2015 08:39 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for JBoe   Click Here to Email JBoe     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I found several Space Station Payload Operations, Payload, and Increment patches being sold on eBay. These patches are the first I've seen of and would like to know more about them. I'm assuming these patches were made while the construction of the International Space Station occurred. Thanks again!

(eBay auctions: 221964629898, 221964629730, 221964630116, 221957932064)

Kevin T. Randall
Member

Posts: 830
From: Chesham, Bucks UK
Registered: Dec 2008

posted 12-26-2015 07:59 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Kevin T. Randall   Click Here to Email Kevin T. Randall     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
It has been extremely difficult to find out any information about these ISS Payload Operations patches and pins, other than from the current seller. The ones that he had/has, originated from his son in law who was directly employed by NASA as a graphic designer for the International Space Station, and was based at the Marshall Space Flight Center, Huntsville, Alabama.

It is unknown if these patches and pins are official NASA ones, or privately commissioned? Whichever it was, they only produced these patches and pins in small numbers, just for the design team working on the construction of the International Space Station. Hence why these patches and pins have not been seen or recorded before.

It looks like the patches started from ISS Payload Increment Operations number 6, and went on from there, 7, 8, 9, X, 11, 12, 13, 14, XV, 16, 17, 18, 19/20, 21/22. (There are patches and pins for Ops-23/24, Ops-25/26, Ops-27/28 and beyond)?

It also looks like, at least the later patches were manufactured by AB Emblem. This is because the Ops-21/22 patch has their product number 159287 and date code 12/09 16 embedded label on the back of it. None of the preceding Operations patches have those embedded labels on them. (But that doesn't mean they weren't manufactured by AB Emblem).

The seller's son in law also had/has the matching pins for each of the ISS-Payload Increment Operations patches. They also look to be U.S. manufactured as well.

The seller will be listing four more lots of the pins before the end of this year.

There are no more patches to be listed at this moment in time until the current seller meets up with his son in law next year, 2016. Then hopefully all the other missing Operations patches and pins will then come to light. (Those patches are; Ops-7, 8, 11, 12, 14, Ops-23/24, Ops-27/28 Ops-29/30)?

Update;
Unfortunately this didn't happen the patches and pins listed above were lost, possibly thrown out with the trash by mistake.

SparkR_13
Member

Posts: 93
From: Martinsburg, WV 25401, USA
Registered: Dec 2010

posted 12-28-2015 10:43 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for SparkR_13   Click Here to Email SparkR_13     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I have reached out to some folks at MSFC to see if they can come up with any background information as well. Awaiting results. I have forwarded your comments though Kevin, hopefully it might allow them to pinpoint the creator, etc.

Robert Pearlman
Editor

Posts: 39963
From: Houston, TX
Registered: Nov 1999

posted 12-28-2015 10:46 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Robert Pearlman   Click Here to Email Robert Pearlman     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
A friend of mine is a PayCom (similar role to a CapCom but for payloads on the space station) at Marshall Space Flight Center. I asked her about these patches:
Yes, I have seen and have most of them. We have Increment Lead teams designated for each pair of increments and many of those patches are designs made to commemorate those missions. Others are general Payload Ops patches designed by folks in the POIC [Payload Operations Integration Center].

Kevin T. Randall
Member

Posts: 830
From: Chesham, Bucks UK
Registered: Dec 2008

posted 12-28-2015 08:15 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Kevin T. Randall   Click Here to Email Kevin T. Randall     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Wow! Many thanks Stephen and Robert. How nice it is to know people on the inside who can shed some more light on these very interesting patches and pins. I would love to see the complete set of these ISS Payload Operations patches and pins. Let's hope your inside contacts come up trumps?

SparkR_13
Member

Posts: 93
From: Martinsburg, WV 25401, USA
Registered: Dec 2010

posted 12-29-2015 08:58 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for SparkR_13   Click Here to Email SparkR_13     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
One of the ideas I always push when I talk to folks "In the Loop" when it comes to where these patches are originating from is to take an idea from the Navy. On most submarines, it is the COB (Chief of the Boat - Senior Chief onboard), who is in charge of the sub's patch. If you want one, you had to buy it from him. Those funds then go back into making more patches, but also the "Rec" fund for other uses.

So in this case, I always push the charity aspect for the NASA folks, perhaps, someone who could be in charge, would be willing to authorize additional patches to be made and sold for "charity" reasons. We patch collectors buy them, the money they can then donate to a charity. (Think CFC for govt. workers.) Everyone would be a winner!

Of course they could then use the same funds to allow their own people to get a patch - free, without the use of tax dollars either. See... pass along!

Robert Pearlman
Editor

Posts: 39963
From: Houston, TX
Registered: Nov 1999

posted 12-29-2015 09:14 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Robert Pearlman   Click Here to Email Robert Pearlman     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by SparkR_13:
I always push the charity aspect for the NASA folks, perhaps, someone who could be in charge, would be willing to authorize additional patches to be made and sold for "charity" reasons.
For federal employees, this is against the law. Civil servants cannot use their position in the government, or the resources afforded to them by their job, to benefit commercial or charitable organizations (or, for that matter, themselves). They also cannot appear to endorse any charity.

Contractors are not under the same restrictions, but generally NASA's contract with the contractors prohibit such activities or the company's own policies may preclude them.

JBoe
Member

Posts: 900
From: Churchton, MD
Registered: Oct 2012

posted 12-31-2015 09:44 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for JBoe   Click Here to Email JBoe     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Kevin, Robert, and Stephen; thanks again for providing this wealth of information and looking into/following up with the folks Marshall Space Flight Center.

If they were manufactured by AB Emblem, would it be possible for them to reproduce them? I would assume that they would need the MSFC creator's approval first right?

Robert Pearlman
Editor

Posts: 39963
From: Houston, TX
Registered: Nov 1999

posted 12-31-2015 10:16 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Robert Pearlman   Click Here to Email Robert Pearlman     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
AB Emblem would need NASA's permission to release the designs for public sale.

But even with permission, there might not be enough of a market to justify an order. AB's minimum order is 50 pieces of one design. And there are almost 50 increments. Maybe I am wrong, but I do not believe there are 50 collectors looking to buy 50 patches each for this particular subject.

Kevin T. Randall
Member

Posts: 830
From: Chesham, Bucks UK
Registered: Dec 2008

posted 01-01-2016 07:16 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Kevin T. Randall   Click Here to Email Kevin T. Randall     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I agree with Robert in that it is going to be very unlikely that any more of these patches will ever be reproduced (other than if someone with very deep pockets takes on that project). It will just be a question of waiting until some of the other members of the MSFC ISS-Payload Operations and Increments design teams put their patches and pins up for sale on the secondary market. (Which I feel could be later on this year, as there are at least three or four interested collectors like myself out there.)

JBoe
Member

Posts: 900
From: Churchton, MD
Registered: Oct 2012

posted 01-01-2016 11:01 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for JBoe   Click Here to Email JBoe     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I guess I'll just have to wait with you all. Thanks again!

James913
Member

Posts: 150
From: Houston, TX USA
Registered: Oct 2004

posted 08-21-2018 02:46 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for James913   Click Here to Email James913     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I missed this thread the first time around, but just found it in a related search. I can add some info here – yes, there are Payload Ops patches and pins for all of the early ISS increments. Here are the 1- 7 patches (w/ #6 already shown above). These all had pins of the same design. (These patches aren’t shown in the proper scale to one another – e.g., the increment 0/1 patch is 4 inches in diameter while the increment 2 patch is only 2x4 inches.)

If you get the chance, you might want to display these with the Payload Operations and Integration Center patch below – this is the facility at the Marshall Space Flight Center that coordinates and runs payload ops on the ISS.

I worked in the POIC (also known as the Huntsville Operations Support Center) for STS-35 (Astro-1) back in the Spacelab days before ISS, but we didn’t have patches back then for individual HOSC/POIC missions.

Kevin T. Randall
Member

Posts: 830
From: Chesham, Bucks UK
Registered: Dec 2008

posted 08-21-2018 09:15 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Kevin T. Randall   Click Here to Email Kevin T. Randall     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Many thanks for this information and photos James.

All times are CT (US)

next newest topic | next oldest topic

Administrative Options: Close Topic | Archive/Move | Delete Topic
Post New Topic  Post A Reply
Hop to:

Contact Us | The Source for Space History & Artifacts

Copyright 2018 collectSPACE.com All rights reserved.


Ultimate Bulletin Board 5.47a





advertisement