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Author
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Topic: Vote for the 'Greatest American'
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Robert Pearlman
Editor Posts: 26584
From: Houston, TX
Registered: Nov 1999
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posted 06-05-2005 06:20 PM
   
Tonight, the Discovery Channel airs the first of four Sunday night specials to title the 'Greatest American'. A list of 100 candidates were nominated by over 500,000 people. Each week, nominees will be eliminated until June 26, when during a live finale Matt Lauer (NBC's Today Show) will reveal the Greatest American.Voting is based on the #1 person who has most embodied the American dream, having the biggest impact on the way we think, work and live. The show was inspired by previous versions aired in countries including England, France and Germany. Voting will take place via phone, SMS and online through:
http://tv.channel.aol.com/greatestamerican The list of nominees includes several space history-related figures, including astronauts John Glenn and Neil Armstrong. Astronomer Carl Sagan and test pilot Chuck Yeager also make the list. The full list can be found at the above website. Air times are as follows: Sunday, June 5th @ 8p e/p
Sunday, June 12th @ 9p e/p
Sunday, June 19th @ 9p e/p
Sunday, June 26th @ 9p e/p (live finale) |
John K. Rochester
Member Posts: 1271
From: Rochester, NY, USA
Registered: Mar 2002
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posted 06-05-2005 06:28 PM
Man.. about 1/3rd of those people I would never have thought would be classified as the 100 greatest Americans.. but to prevent arguments, I won't say who should absolutely, positively ( IMHO ) should be nowhere near this list. Neil may be in the top 10, but not #1 in my voting.. You? |
ejectr
Member Posts: 1482
From: Brimfield, MA
Registered: Mar 2002
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posted 06-05-2005 07:22 PM
So how do you vote on line???? |
Ben
Member Posts: 1841
From: Daytona Beach, FL
Registered: May 2000
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posted 06-05-2005 07:23 PM
I would include a couple astronauts on the list, I don't know who but Neil and Glenn certainly up there. Don't forget these were chosen by AOL users, and likely they are the only astronauts they have heard of. Boy I may like (and like a lot even) some of the people on there, but Dr. Phil, Laura Bush, Anrold S., John Edwards and Michael Moore are not among the 100 Greatest Americans. They are just in the spotlight now and will be forgotton in generations ahead (unless Dr Phil becomes president!). So far Matt Lauer hasn't denied that either. I don't even agree with Einstein on that list because he is not American (though I would put him in the top ten people in history worldwide). But sticking to space, I would probably agree with Sagan as well being on there. He contributed to some of the greatest theories in space and science that we know today. He is the American Einstein, you might say.
[This message has been edited by Ben (edited June 05, 2005).] |
Scott
Member Posts: 3292
From: Houston, TX
Registered: May 2001
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posted 06-05-2005 07:28 PM
Some truly great names, but I'll concur with Robert on this one:Elvis. Hands down. |
Ben
Member Posts: 1841
From: Daytona Beach, FL
Registered: May 2000
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posted 06-05-2005 07:43 PM
I would also add Edwin Hubble with Carl Sagan. National Geographic's May issue discussed him with Einstein as the greatest scientests of all time for their implications on the world; it was Hubble who discovered that that patch in the sky was not a fuzzy star, but a 'galaxy', and for the first time it was realized that we were not alone nor unique. |
Rick
Member Posts: 250
From: Yadkinville, NC
Registered: Jun 2000
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posted 06-05-2005 07:53 PM
Think what you may about his autograph and haircut policies, but my vote goes to Neil Armstrong. He is the American dream. His family wasn't rich and it wasn't destitute ... they were the average American family. He then set a goal for himself, to become a pilot, and he reached it. He became an astronaut ... and became the first human to step foot on the lunar surface. Hands down, he has my vote. I'll say this ... it's criminal for Armstrong's name to be mentioned on the same list of candidates as some of the others. If ... well, I'm not gonna get into politics ... but if Ray Charles or Ellen Degeneres, Brett Favre or ... dear God ... Michael Jackson is named greatest American, I may very well move. |
fabfivefreddy
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posted 06-05-2005 08:08 PM
I am surprised that President Andrew Jackson is not on the list.
Personally, I would vote for Lincoln at the top.
Armstrong is historically important, but the other moonwalkers could have gone first and done fine.
A 'Great American" should be one that the nation could never replace (and still exist). Would America have existed without Lincoln, Jefferson, etc.?Tahir [This message has been edited by fabfivefreddy (edited June 05, 2005).] |
Astro Bill
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posted 06-05-2005 08:11 PM
Sorry, but I will be watching the celebrity dance competion on ABC instead of "Who is the Greatest American." In such a "Greatest" competition we would be comparing apples and oranges and grapes and a few watermellons. It is all a matter of opinion. My vote is for Teri Hatcher of "Desperate Housewives" (even if she is not nominated), not for an astronaut who was first to set foot on the Moon a few minutes before the second person to set foot on the Moon and the 3rd and 4th months later. Seriously, if George Washington or FDR or Eisenhower or Alexander the Great (non-American) is on the list, I will vote for one of them before I would vote for Armstrong. |
Astro Bill
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posted 06-05-2005 08:45 PM
Does anyone remember seeing the Apollo XI Moon Landing in 1969? How much time was there between Armstrong's first footstep on the Moon and Aldrin's? Does anyone think that Armstrong is a better American or greater American than Abraham Lincoln?
[This message has been edited by Astro Bill (edited June 05, 2005).] |
Ben
Member Posts: 1841
From: Daytona Beach, FL
Registered: May 2000
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posted 06-05-2005 09:20 PM
Armstrong is in the top 25 which are the only people you can vote for.Now the AOL link is active. [This message has been edited by Ben (edited June 05, 2005).] |
Robert Pearlman
Editor Posts: 26584
From: Houston, TX
Registered: Nov 1999
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posted 06-05-2005 09:57 PM
You can now vote at the site above. Each person (IP address, presumeably) has three votes per week. I just gave all three of mine (from home at least) to Armstrong. As the only space person to make the 25, it would be nice to see him advance to the finals, if only as a representative of the entire space program. |
earlyduke
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posted 06-05-2005 10:05 PM
Wow, some of the people on that list make me think one thing - - that
the whole exercise is a farce!
Gimme a break! - - Dr. Phil?? Madonna? Michael Jackson?? Why not
O.J., or Bozo the Clown?
Where are the 3 Stooges, and Gilligan and the Skipper?
If I were Armstrong, or a Thomas Edison, I'd be pretty offended.I'm in agreement mostly with Astro Bill. Armstrong really shouldn't
be on this list, and I bet he'd be the first to say so.
If anything, the correct nominee would be the entire Apollo 11 crew,
and Armstrong would probably be uncomfortable
with that too, since he's always insisted that he, Buzz and Mike were
just the embodiment of all the people who made
their mission a success. (And anyway, I'd vote for the Apollo 8 crew
over the Apollo 11 crew anyway). I think the whole idea of choosing any one person as the greatest
American is pretty ridiculous, but if I had to choose,
my winner would have to be Al Gore, the
inventor of the internet! |
Robert Pearlman
Editor Posts: 26584
From: Houston, TX
Registered: Nov 1999
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posted 06-05-2005 10:28 PM
While I agree the quality of the list is questionable at best, we only have ourselves to blame. The nominees were chosen by the public - more than 500,000 of us - which just goes to show the quality of the average AOL user (where voting apparently was hosted). Then again, consider the timing - this is as much intended as summer entertainment as the typical blockbuster movie released this season. If Armstrong gets eliminated the first round, it won't mean very much in the scheme of things. However, if he were to make it to the top 10/top 5 - let alone be named "Greatest American" it would serve as one indication of the public's support for the space program. |
earlyduke
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posted 06-05-2005 10:40 PM
I just saw that AOL/Discovery has already narrowed the field to 25.Even more ridiculous than before. Jonas Salk, Alexander Graham Bell and Pat Tilman didn't make the cut,
but Oprah did? I need an advil. |
Spacepsycho
Member Posts: 711
From: Huntington Beach, Calif.
Registered: Aug 2004
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posted 06-05-2005 10:43 PM
I think the idea of picking a "single greatest american" is a little offensive since the premise of this country's origin was that we all should work to build this place into the best country in the history of the world.Regardless, the obvious choices are Washington, Jefferson, Lincoln, and while Armstrong is a deservedly heroic figure, there were 400,000 people who devoted themselves to put the 12 men who walked on the moon there. To me they're all hero's but not the greatest american, if there is such a thing. My choice is probably a little trite, but my vote would have to go to the US Soldier. Our US fighting men & women have freed Europe from tyranny & facisim 2 times, they've freed millions of people across the world, they've devoted themselves to stopping the spread of communism, they've volunteered to put themselves in harms way to prevent a psychotic madman from taking over the flow of oil to the western nations and they have been there whenever called upon to give their full measure to defend this country. It doesn't matter which side of the political fence you're on, the US Soldier has been the reason this country has enjoyed relative peace on our own shores, while helping stop the bad guys from enslaving billions. Ray |
earlyduke
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posted 06-05-2005 10:55 PM
In a thoughtful, serious poll, Ray's nominee, the U.S. soldier,
would/should win, hands down. |
fabfivefreddy
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posted 06-05-2005 10:55 PM
Ray-
I must say that I agree with your analysis about the U.S. Soldier.
From the Revolutionary war to WW II and even now, the soldiers have placed themselves in harm's way for the benefit of freedom.
The astronauts would count too as they risked their lives in the military as well.
The more I think about it, you are right- as many of our best President's were also taking great risks to defend America.
So there you have it- the U.S. Soldier or Aviator (including all military branches). Tahir |
Astro Bill
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posted 06-05-2005 11:09 PM
I agree with Robert that if Neil Armstrong wins it will mean that there is support for the space program. It will also mean that a majority of the voters have no knowledge of American history. That is why I agree with Tahir above and I voted for Abraham Lincoln, who gave his life to keep this country together. How could the winner be anyone other than a President or perhaps Edison or Martin Luther King? Robert mentioned in another thread that Neil Armstrong will be mentioned in history books. Yes, he will be mentioned in American history books. However, there are now many chapters on Abraham Lincoln and hundreds of books. I respect every astronaut for their exceptional bravery and intelligence. But we have many brave people in the US, including the firemen and policemen killed in the World Trade Center because they were going upstairs while everyone was going downstairs. Lance Armstrong may be very courageous and Oprah may be very entertaining. But the Greatest American is a personal matter of choice. I can understand why many Americans would vote for Rev. Martin Luther King, also a very courageous American. |
zee_aladdin
Member Posts: 773
From: California
Registered: Oct 2004
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posted 06-05-2005 11:29 PM
Well, Carl Sagan should not be on the list of Greatest American, they found out (and I do have the newspaper article) that he smoked pot on a regular basis! Plus, he was an Atheist, which even though I have nothing against them, falls AGAINST most of mainstream America that has 'IN GOD WE TRUST' on our currency, and we have the Ten Commandments hanging all over our Judiciary courts. The U.S. Soldier should not be nominated because most of the soldiers I have spoken with (who have backgrounds from the Vietnam war all the way to the Iraqi war) have told me that they were just following orders and did not really want to be in a war. Second place should go to John Glenn because he is awesome on a Moral Level (still married and a great family man after all these years), and an Inspiration to ALL of us, since he went back into space and proved that he still had the spirit of Science and discovery. First Place should go to ... Benjamin Franklin, a man who was extremely influential in both the Scientific and Spiritual Worlds. He is one of those rare individuals who was balanced and intelligent on many levels. He Should Be the #1 American.  |
Rodina
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posted 06-05-2005 11:31 PM
And Fredrick Douglass isn't in the Top 25? Sigh. One of the greatest champions of individual liberty in history.
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gliderpilotuk
Member Posts: 2996
From: London, UK
Registered: Feb 2002
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posted 06-06-2005 05:01 AM
The British results were:1. Churchill
2. Brunel
3. Diana
4. Darwin
5. Shakespeare
6. Newton
7. Lennon
8. Elizabeth I
9. Nelson
10. Cromwell You see the cult of the celebrity is everywhere. How on Earth could Diana and Lennon be considered in the same company as Churchill or Shakespeare? At least no footballers made it to the top 10, but the influence of the mass media, the poor state of history teaching (it's not PC to teach English history in depth any more) and pre-defined shortlists all had their effect. At least Churchill wasn't controversial but Frank Whittle, Michael Faraday, Florence Nightingale, George Stevenson, Alexander Fleming etc, etc were all way down the list. IMHO there's also a strong argument for saying that no living person should be eligible. Paul Bramley
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carmelo
Member Posts: 777
From: Messina, Sicilia, Italia
Registered: Jun 2004
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posted 06-06-2005 10:06 AM
The guy buried in the tomb of unknown soldier in Arlington.He saved my grandfather from Prussians,my father from nazis,me from comunism,and ,perhaps,my son from an islamic theocracy.
[This message has been edited by carmelo (edited June 06, 2005).] |
Scott
Member Posts: 3292
From: Houston, TX
Registered: May 2001
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posted 06-06-2005 10:30 AM
quote:
Originally posted by zee_aladdin:
Well, Carl Sagan should not be on the list of Greatest American, they found out (and I do have the newspaper article) that he smoked pot on a regular basis! Plus, he was an Atheist, which even though I have nothing against them, falls AGAINST most of mainstream America that has 'IN GOD WE TRUST' on our currency, and we have the Ten Commandments hanging all over our Judiciary courts.
At first I thought you were joking when I read this paragraph, Zee, but apparently you weren't. Oh well...  |
Robert Pearlman
Editor Posts: 26584
From: Houston, TX
Registered: Nov 1999
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posted 06-06-2005 10:47 AM
Well, for the record - had Sagan made the top 25 list, I would have gladly voted for him. I felt it an honor to spend a weekend with him at Cornell as part of a symposium he ran for a small group of astronomy enthusiasts. (As an aside, it was equally a privilege to work with his son Nick, years later.) |
RMH
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posted 06-06-2005 12:03 PM
Like Robert I'm going to vote for Armstrong for the space reference. I thought it was interesting that in one of the many print ads they had for this program they used a full page image of Neil Armtrong, not of him on the moon or even in an Apollo space suit but a photo of him in a Gemini 8 space suit. |
Wehaveliftoff
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posted 06-06-2005 12:39 PM
My vote was for John Glenn, one of the greatest public servants this country has ever known; and he's the best signer of any astronaut, which doesn't hurt his chances either.
[This message has been edited by Wehaveliftoff (edited June 06, 2005).] |
Mike Isbell
Member Posts: 338
From: Silver Spring, Maryland USA
Registered: Aug 2003
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posted 06-06-2005 03:45 PM
With regard to who is the greatest American, while I have no problem with Sen. Glenn or Neil Armstrong being in consideration, I would have to note that their name reconition comes from the luck of the draw as to wdich space missions they were assigned to, rather than theirindividual contributions. That said, I would have to think that many, if not most, of the other contestants also acheived there positions in history by being in the right place at the right time also. With so many people abd such diverse contributions having been made, I am of the opinion that it is folly to try to single out any one person as the greatesr American.
All this said, if I were forced to cast a vote, I would probably have selected Sen. Glenn.[This message has been edited by Mike Isbell (edited June 06, 2005).] |
Astro Bill
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posted 06-06-2005 05:37 PM
quote:
Originally posted by gliderpilotuk:
The British results were:1. Churchill
2. Brunel
3. Diana
4. Darwin
5. Shakespeare
6. Newton
7. Lennon
8. Elizabeth I
9. Nelson
10. Cromwell You see the cult of the celebrity is everywhere. How on Earth could Diana and Lennon be considered in the same company as Churchill or Shakespeare? At least no footballers made it to the top 10, but the influence of the mass media, the poor state of history teaching (it's not PC to teach English history in depth any more) and pre-defined shortlists all had their effect. At least Churchill wasn't controversial but Frank Whittle, Michael Faraday, Florence Nightingale, George Stevenson, Alexander Fleming etc, etc were all way down the list. IMHO there's also a strong argument for saying that no living person should be eligible. Paul Bramley
I agree that no living person should be eligible.
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Astro Bill
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posted 06-06-2005 05:39 PM
quote:
Originally posted by earlyduke:
I just saw that AOL/Discovery has already narrowed the field to 25.Even more ridiculous than before. Jonas Salk, Alexander Graham Bell and Pat Tilman didn't make the cut,
but Oprah did? I need an advil.
The voters are apparently voting in a popularity contest instead of a Greatest American survey. [This message has been edited by Astro Bill (edited June 06, 2005).] |
Astro Bill
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posted 06-06-2005 05:46 PM
quote:
Originally posted by Mike Isbell:
With regard to who is the greatest American, while I have no problem with Sen. Glenn or Neil Armstrong being in consideration, I would have to note that there name reconition comes from the luck of the draw as to wdich space missions they were assigned to, rather than there individual contributions. That said, I would have to many, if not most, of the other contestants also acheived there positions in history by being in the right place at the right time also. With so many people abd such diverse contributions having been made, I am of the opinion that it is folly to try to single out any one person as the greatesr American.
That said, if I were forced to cast a vote, I would probably select Sen. Glenn.
John Glenn is not in the final 25. |
Mike Isbell
Member Posts: 338
From: Silver Spring, Maryland USA
Registered: Aug 2003
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posted 06-06-2005 06:29 PM
Bill,
I did not see the show last night. Who are the 25 remaining ?Mike |
Astro Bill
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posted 06-06-2005 08:29 PM
quote:
Originally posted by Mike Isbell:
Bill,
I did not see the show last night. Who are the 25 remaining ?Mike
Go to Robert's initial posting in this thread and there is a link that will take you to the list of 25 finalists with photos. It takes a minute or so to open the link. Then you can vote three times a week on every computer that you have. The British final 10 are interesting, but with both contests end in one Greatest person or 10 Greatest persons? |
gliderpilotuk
Member Posts: 2996
From: London, UK
Registered: Feb 2002
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posted 06-07-2005 01:33 PM
quote:
Originally posted by Astro Bill:
The British final 10 are interesting, but with both contests end in one Greatest person or 10 Greatest persons?
Churchill received the most votes by a fair margin. I only list the other nine for interest. As I said before, two of those in the top ten cannot hold a candle to the likes of Churchill and simply reflect current fads. Paul |
Astro Bill
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posted 06-07-2005 05:50 PM
Who is "Brunei" in the British list?Is this the ACTUAL top ten on the British list or is it a SELECTION of the top 25? Will the list stop at ten or will they pick one "Greatest Bitain"? |
MrSpace86
Member Posts: 1360
From: Gardner, KS, USA
Registered: Feb 2003
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posted 06-07-2005 06:22 PM
I would vote for Abraham Lincoln too. I don't think Armstrong or Glenn have a legit chance, but they would deserve to be like #10 or something.
I don't see why Martin Luther King has a good chance. Why not Muhammad Ali? All these guys did was run around protesting (even though I'm a big admirer of both).
It will most likely go to a President, since they have made crucial decisions for America and some of them have even been assasinated for those decisions and what they believe in. Something weird like 'The American Soldier' or something lame like that representing the current status of the country might also win too.
Yuri Gagarin should win the award
-Rodrigo |
quantumleap
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posted 06-07-2005 06:29 PM
Sigh - Brunei is a country, not a person.BRUNEL (Isambard Kingdom Brunel is his full name) was an engineer in the 1800's who made significant impact in multiple areas such as bridges, railways, ships, etc.. Go to http://web.ukonline.co.uk/b.gardner/brunel/kingbrun.html for more information. We recently had such a television based "Greatest Canadian" here. Tommy Douglas, a politician, won it. He was social policy innovator, and is recognised as the "Father of Medicare" in Canada, along with others such as social welfare, old age pensions and mother's allowances. It is interesting to see that this choice, like Churchill's in the UK, in some way personifies each respective country. Churchill stands for the British for spirit and determination in the face of overwhelming odds and adversity. While the rest of Europe was falling to Hitler's war machine, and others were practising isolationism, he was the tireless force which mobilised Britain to defy the advance. He embodied the "British Bulldog" attitude which for example people in London showed as they suffered through the Blitz. [This message has been edited by quantumleap (edited June 07, 2005).] |
spacegrl13
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posted 06-07-2005 07:03 PM
Quote:
"Robert mentioned in another thread that Neil Armstrong will be mentioned in history books. Yes, he will be mentioned in American history books. However, there are now many chapters on Abraham Lincoln and hundreds of books." Actually, I looked in our School History book. This year we are doing US History, and Neil Armstrong isn't mentioned ONCE in the whole book, even though the book covers the 60's. As a matter of fact the only astronaut mentioned is John Glenn (Hello, what about Alan Shepard!), there are also three pictures of John Glenn. I doubt that half of the people my age (16) could say that Neil was the first to walk on the moon. Also, if they could name one astronaut it would be John Glenn, eveyone seems to think he was the first person in space. I guess it's up to me to fill them in!
cheers,
Helen |
Astro Bill
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posted 06-07-2005 07:23 PM
quote:
Originally posted by spacegrl13:
Quote:
"Robert mentioned in another thread that Neil Armstrong will be mentioned in history books. Yes, he will be mentioned in American history books. However, there are now many chapters on Abraham Lincoln and hundreds of books." Actually, I looked in our School History book. This year we are doing US History, and Neil Armstrong isn't mentioned ONCE in the whole book, even though the book covers the 60's. As a matter of fact the only astronaut mentioned is John Glenn (Hello, what about Alan Shepard!), there are also three pictures of John Glenn. I doubt that half of the people my age (16) could say that Neil was the first to walk on the moon. Also, if they could name one astronaut it would be John Glenn, eveyone seems to think he was the first person in space. I guess it's up to me to fill them in!
cheers,
Helen
Hello Helen. Thanks for your reply to my posting. Sometimes i feel like I am a voice in the wilderness and that there are no listeners. So Armstrong is not mentioned in recent history books and Glenn is mentioned several times. What about Abraham Lincoln and George Washington and Ben Franklin, were they mentioned over many chapters as I stated or has history class changed greatly since I graduated in 1962? This is not to say that Armstrong and Aldrin did not do a great thing. But Armstrong was chosen by fate to be first. Why is that exceptional? I personally voted for Abraham Lincoln who gave his life for an ideal called the United States. I believe that the other assassinated presidents were killed by fanatics. Perhaps I should have voted for Ben Franklin. He was a Founding Father but he was too old and too ill to be President, but every American still justly appreciates his vision, resolve and stamina. |
Astro Bill
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posted 06-07-2005 07:40 PM
quote:
Originally posted by MrSpace86:
I would vote for Abraham Lincoln too. I don't think Armstrong or Glenn have a legit chance, but they would deserve to be like #10 or something.
I don't see why Martin Luther King has a good chance. Why not Muhammad Ali? All these guys did was run around protesting (even though I'm a big admirer of both).
It will most likely go to a President, since they have made crucial decisions for America and some of them have even been assasinated for those decisions and what they believe in. Something weird like 'The American Soldier' or something lame like that representing the current status of the country might also win too.
Yuri Gagarin should win the award
-Rodrigo
Dear Rodrigo - I cannot tell if you are serious about the comments that you made or if you are trying to get a reaction to some of your ill-conceived comments. Did you place a funny face at the end of your comments to say that you were not serious about the entire posting or just the last comment? On the chance that you are serious about some of your comments, I will reply. I recall seeing Rev. Martin Luther King on TV many times in the 60's. He was not just "running around" as your stated. He saw a problem with segregation and he chose to protest it and correct it. He personally risked his life many times in protests and he served time in jail because of his beliefs. He was assassinated in 1968 shortly before Robert Kennedy was assassinated. He is now honored with a natioinal holiday every year in the US and his ideals and memory still live in everyone who believes as he did. There may still be some problems with racism, but segregation as a policy has been ended because of what he did. Your comment that the possible nomination of the "American Soldier" as the Greatest American is lame, shows that you have no idea of the contribution that they all have made for our country AND for the world. The problem with this "contest" is that there are too many good choices for the Greatest American. |
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