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  Gordon Cooper on Apollo 13:the Ed Mitchell said...

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Author Topic:   Gordon Cooper on Apollo 13:the Ed Mitchell said...
carmelo
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Posts: 792
From: Messina, Sicilia, Italia
Registered: Jun 2004

posted 11-11-2004 06:37 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for carmelo   Click Here to Email carmelo     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I have written to Edgard Mitchell in "edmitchellapollo14.com forum" :"Doctor Mitchell,the astronauts of Apollo 10 backcrew were Gordon Cooper CDR,Don Eisle CMP,and Ed Mitchell LMP.Why the same crew was not rotate on Apollo 13 (or 14)"? And this is the answer :"Gordon retired after Apollo 10.You are correct,Apollo 13 was the normal rotation for us after A10.When Shepard was assigned to 13 in place of Cooper,NASA headquartiers suggested more training time,and thus a mission swap with lovell's crew.We got lucky,but didn't realize it at the time". But Gordon Cooper gone away in 1970,not in 1969,AFTER Shepard assigment,is so? And Don Eisle?

Fra Mauro
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From: Maspeth, NY
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posted 11-12-2004 11:10 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Fra Mauro   Click Here to Email Fra Mauro     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Cooper was bumped from the rotation in 1969 in favor of Shepard. Eisele was asked to resign from the astronaut corps in mid-69 after Apollo 10. According to Stafford and Slayton, due to personal circumstances, including the death of his son and a divorce, it was felt that he wasn't focused enough. There was also repercussions from the Apollo 7 flight.

carmelo
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From: Messina, Sicilia, Italia
Registered: Jun 2004

posted 11-12-2004 12:53 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for carmelo   Click Here to Email carmelo     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Yes,Cooper was bumped from the rotation IN FAVOR OF SHEPARD,not "retired after Apollo 10" ! The Ed Mitchell version is "politically correct",no?

Fra Mauro
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From: Maspeth, NY
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posted 11-12-2004 02:10 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Fra Mauro   Click Here to Email Fra Mauro     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
True--he retired because he couldn't get another flight. Also, he doesn't mention Eisele who died years ago and maybe Mitchell doesn't feel it's fair to say something that Eisele can't respond to.

Duke Of URL
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From: Syracuse, NY, USA
Registered: Jan 2005

posted 01-25-2005 02:18 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Duke Of URL   Click Here to Email Duke Of URL     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
You have to be some kind of a cold-hearted SOB to fire a guy after his kid dies and going through a divorce because he's "distracted".

Kinda like the cold-hearted SOB who would stab an old buddy in the back to get a quicker flight or promote his collegue into it.

carmelo
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From: Messina, Sicilia, Italia
Registered: Jun 2004

posted 01-25-2005 09:55 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for carmelo   Click Here to Email carmelo     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Duke Of URL:
You have to be some kind of a cold-hearted SOB to fire a guy after his kid dies and going through a divorce because he's "distracted".

Kinda like the cold-hearted SOB who would stab an old buddy in the back to get a quicker flight or promote his collegue into it.


Or someone that has not able to fly for a HEART's problem.....

MoonMan Jeff
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posted 01-25-2005 06:45 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for MoonMan Jeff   Click Here to Email MoonMan Jeff     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Didn't Chris Kraft say in his book "Flight" that after puttting up with the shenanigans of the A-7 crew disregarding orders in flight, that he vowed that none of the 3 on that flight would ever fly a mission again (as long as he had anything to do with it).

Even if that view was not totally shared by Deke, I suspect Kraft had more than enough weight in these decisions to ensure that Eisele's future in NASA was bleak.

Also, Chaikin mentions briefly that Eisele's split with his former wife greatly shook up NASA (which still wanted that squeaky-clean image for the astronauts) and it also shook up the so-called Astronauts Wives Club to the point where they basically broke up altogether over the issue of whether to accept his new wife.

But then Chaikin points out that Al Worden had also gotten a divorce and it had not affected his status on A-15. So I suspect the fallout from the Apollo 7 episodes and Kraft's animus toward the entire crew was the main reason Eisele didnt fly again, not the marriage or death of his son.

R.Glueck
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posted 01-25-2005 09:02 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for R.Glueck   Click Here to Email R.Glueck     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Eisele was hardly discreet with his affair, and the other wives knew their own relationships were balanced on a knife edge. The astronauts had little problem picking up a pretty, young, miss for a night at any place they stayed overnight. Cunningham mentions it in his book as well. The other piece is that Eisele's child was mentally retarded. He was definitely not going back in NASA's front window.

As far as Apollo 7 was concerned, Kraft was thoroughly pissed off by each of the crew. They were off flight status permanently as far as he was concerned. Kraft later recollects, "Perhaps I was a little too harsh with Eisele and Cunningham", but I think this is a case where Kraft is looking over his shoulder while actively walking away. He had plenty of qualified astronauts who would listen to him and not bitch during a mission. The transcripts show that the whole crew got into Wally's mode.

Gordo got dealt out because Shepard saw a vulnerable peer and acted in concert with Deke's doubts about Gordo's lack of concern for training. Plain and simple, Gordo wasn't really concerned with perfectly his skills for a lunar landing, and Shepard wanted the earliest opportunity he could grab to walk on the moon. The handwriting was on the wall about expected cancellations, so Big Al flattened another Mercury astronaut. This was not the first time Shepard used his power in such a manner.

Duke Of URL
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From: Syracuse, NY, USA
Registered: Jan 2005

posted 01-25-2005 11:06 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Duke Of URL   Click Here to Email Duke Of URL     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Gordo rose to every occasion, doing yeoman work on his flights. I also suspect Deke and Shepard knew him well enough to realize his manner was laid back and that it could be falsely confused with laziness.

There isn't much doubt of Cooper's abilities as a pilot, so even if Shepard was a better airplane driver Gordo's experience and training made up whatever slight difference there was.

His friends stabbed him in the back, plain and simple. It can be rationalized and explained, but it was a first-class hatchet job.

But, sadly, it happened and it's over. Apparently the three resolved their issues,and that's as good an ending as anyone could wish for. I hope God treats these men well.

All times are CT (US)

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