Topic: STS-51L: Video footage of Challenger disaster
garyd2831 Member
Posts: 640 From: Syracuse, New York, USA Registered: Oct 2009
posted 11-12-2012 12:07 PM
Is there any known footage of the Challenger accident from any airborne cameras?
The question came to mind after watching "The Dream is Alive" and seeing the airborne footage of the launch.
dabolton Member
Posts: 419 From: Seneca, IL, US Registered: Jan 2009
posted 11-12-2012 04:11 PM
In a similar train of thought: Columbia had onboard handheld camcorder footage that survived; would have similar footage had survived the ocean impact/immersion from Challenger (had they been aboard) in 1986?
garyd2831 Member
Posts: 640 From: Syracuse, New York, USA Registered: Oct 2009
posted 11-12-2012 04:20 PM
I would probably say no to camera footage being found on the ocean floor. It was several weeks I believe before the destroyed crew compartment was found. My guess would be that the salt water at that depth would have destroyed any film found.
I would still like to know if there is any airborne footage of the accident. It would be interesting to see from that attitude and angle a pilot would of had of the tragedy unfolding.
dabolton Member
Posts: 419 From: Seneca, IL, US Registered: Jan 2009
posted 11-12-2012 06:31 PM
According to the new John Young biography, he witnessed the accident from a T-38. No indication if footage was obtained.
p51 Member
Posts: 1642 From: Olympia, WA Registered: Sep 2011
posted 11-12-2012 07:00 PM
I couldn't imagine such footage doesn't exist. This was a very well-covered launch due to the whole teacher in space angle, more so that any other launch (ironically, given what happened) prior to that, other than the first few test launches...
garyd2831 Member
Posts: 640 From: Syracuse, New York, USA Registered: Oct 2009
posted 11-12-2012 07:10 PM
If footage does exist, it surely has been kept under wrap. I would have to agree due to the amount of attention given to the mission, I can't see why there wouldn't be any footage. In addition I would figure this would be footage that NASA would want to have for all fights for at least study purposes.
dabolton Member
Posts: 419 From: Seneca, IL, US Registered: Jan 2009
posted 11-12-2012 08:26 PM
I don't recall any mention of this in the accident report. It surely would have been called out as evidence.
Robert Pearlman Editor
Posts: 42988 From: Houston, TX Registered: Nov 1999
posted 11-12-2012 08:55 PM
If I am not mistaken, aerial photography was expanded as a result of the loss of Challenger. After the initial test flights (STS-1 through STS-4), it wasn't deemed a requirement for flight.
Also, media attention wouldn't have overruled closed airspace, and despite the attention to Christa McAuliffe, only one network (CNN) was providing live launch footage.
Jay Chladek Member
Posts: 2272 From: Bellevue, NE, USA Registered: Aug 2007
posted 11-12-2012 09:27 PM
Any aircraft airborne at the time over KSC would have been in support of an RTLS abort and Young was likely flying approaches to the KSC runway to report on weather conditions. Even though 51L might have garnered more press coverage than other recent flights due to the Teacher in Space angle (but with the launch coverage satellite feed only being carried on CNN as Robert said), to NASA at KSC, it was more or less still just a "typical" shuttle launch for them and considered routine.
Challenger did likely have a standard set of internal television cameras and a video camcorder on hand, but they would have been stowed for flight. Camcorders back then were rather large beasts weighing a few pounds and you don't want to potentially risk damage if one pops loose during a rocket ascent.
Headshot Member
Posts: 864 From: Vancouver, WA, USA Registered: Feb 2012
posted 11-13-2012 06:44 AM
I seem to recall a few years ago that someone had discovered aerial footage of the Challenger explosion.
It wasn't really revelatory though. I believe it was taken with an 8mm movie camera by a civilian flying a private plane on the outskirts of the launch area no-fly envelope. It was hand-held, a bit jerky (no image stabilization), not in sharp focus, and the image of Challenger was almost invisible as the camera was not equipped with a decent telephoto lens. If the viewer knew the sequence of Challenger's destruction, he/she could tell what was happening by the rocket plumes, if he/she did not, then it would not have enlightened the viewer at all.
I do not recall where I saw it, but it may have been on CNN's site as one of those finding-a-piece-of-history-in-the-attic stories.
Jay Chladek Member
Posts: 2272 From: Bellevue, NE, USA Registered: Aug 2007
posted 11-13-2012 01:23 PM
I don't recall anything shot from a private plane, but two videos did surface (one of these being film based if I recall correctly). One was taken at the Orlando airport and the second one was I believe taken from the Causeway south of the pads.
The Causeway footage provided the best angle of the destruction I had ever seen since you could see the breakup and the debris from the orbiter continuing an upward trajectory for a few seconds before beginning its fall. But as you say Headshot, it was a deal where one had to have studied the sequence of the breakup to identify what they were seeing. It was most certainly better than the TV pool feeds from back by the pad and the VAB.
Only other footage that I know of which surfaced were some black and white footage with tracking cameras at CCAFS which Range Safety uses in their determination whether or not a destruct command is needed (which they did issue to the SRBs after the breakup of the vehicle). That footage aired on the "When We Left Earth" series. It was a very tight in shot of the vehicle though, so it didn't necessarily reveal anymore than what had already been seen and analyzed to that point.
garyd2831 Member
Posts: 640 From: Syracuse, New York, USA Registered: Oct 2009
posted 11-13-2012 09:32 PM
I found this webpage with an airborne photo claiming to be moments before the accident.
Robert Pearlman Editor
Posts: 42988 From: Houston, TX Registered: Nov 1999
posted 11-13-2012 09:40 PM
That is the launch of STS-52 (space shuttle Columbia) in October 1992.
garyd2831 Member
Posts: 640 From: Syracuse, New York, USA Registered: Oct 2009
posted 11-13-2012 09:46 PM
Thanks Robert. Good find.
I actually have some ground photos that were given to me that were taken from two different view points of the launch and accident.
posted 01-11-2013 02:22 PM
My bad, I thought the angle was indicative of it being airborne. I was wondering why nobody had posted that footage. I'll change the title of the clip.
garyd2831 Member
Posts: 640 From: Syracuse, New York, USA Registered: Oct 2009
posted 01-11-2013 06:42 PM
Other than the couple of newly discovered video tapes of the STS-51L launch, this one that is on YouTube provides a very unique view of the launch and one I never see on TV.
Lunar Module 5 Member
Posts: 370 From: Wales, UK Registered: Dec 2004
posted 03-13-2013 03:38 PM
There is footage from other pre-Challenger launches taken from helicopters -
And I would be surprised that if John Young was in a T-38 that he didn't at least have a hand held camera onboard - to be used by a backseater. I take it chase were up in case of a RTLS?
On another but related subject - Why are there so few launch photos from the pad cameras available?
Robert Pearlman Editor
Posts: 42988 From: Houston, TX Registered: Nov 1999
posted 01-17-2014 09:10 AM
A "new" set of photos, originally posted to Reddit by Michael Hindes and making their way around social and now traditional media, appear to be NASA aerial shots of the STS-51L launch. Hindes, who I have been in touch with, writes:
My grandmother actually passed peacefully last week, and was because of her passing that I found these.
We were all going through boxes and boxes of photos to find pictures to display at her memorial. I just happened to get the box with the Challenger pictures at the bottom, which was kind of special for me because I am the biggest NASA fan in the family.
He says that it was his grandfather's friend who took these shots.
After discussing the photographs with a few friends, it's believed these are from the vantage point of a NASA or Air Force helicopter. The view is aerial, but too low to be from the Vehicle Assembly Building roof and too high to be the Launch Control Center roof. A helicopter would also explain the inconsistent framing and horizon.
A lot of the resulting news reports have suggested these are photos never seen before, but that's almost certainly not true. If indeed from a helicopter, than they are nearly certain part of the NASA archive (though may not be online). At least one of the photos has appeared on a Feynman-focused site for at least a decade.
ea757grrl Member
Posts: 729 From: South Carolina Registered: Jul 2006
posted 01-17-2014 03:35 PM
I know these photos have been seen before - although maybe not widely - because I won a set of them in an eBay auction in early 2006.
I don't know the story behind the set, but the photos were in a 1986-vintage photo envelope, and someone's last name was written on the envelope. My guess is the person who took the photos had duplicate sets made for friends/co-workers. They're heartbreakingly vivid pictures.
garyd2831 Member
Posts: 640 From: Syracuse, New York, USA Registered: Oct 2009
posted 01-19-2014 05:52 AM
Just noticed this article via CNN.com.
Jay Chladek Member
Posts: 2272 From: Bellevue, NE, USA Registered: Aug 2007
posted 01-19-2014 11:34 PM
If I had to guess the vantage point where these were taken at, I would say in front of the VAB, possibly from on top of a parked MLP or the crawler vehicle given they seem to be a little higher up than ground level. Even though they are of a vehicle in its final seconds, the shots are very well done. Somebody knew their camera settings well when they took them.
Robert Pearlman Editor
Posts: 42988 From: Houston, TX Registered: Nov 1999
posted 01-19-2014 11:48 PM
I could be mistaken, but I believe the deck of an MLP would be too low.
The photos show the ocean behind the pad.
From the roof of the LCC, which is taller than the MLP, the ocean is barely visible.
From the ground, the ocean is not visible; from the VAB roof, the horizon is farther.
Another reader suggested it could be from a platform inside the VAB looking out through an open door.
posted 01-20-2014 01:06 PM
In the 12th photo in the sequence, scrolling down, what is coming off the shuttle stack? A piece of debris or wisp of burning fuel? I hadn't seen it prior to that photo.
Robert Pearlman Editor
Posts: 42988 From: Houston, TX Registered: Nov 1999
posted 01-20-2014 01:12 PM
I believe that is a bird in the foreground.
cspg Member
Posts: 6210 From: Geneva, Switzerland Registered: May 2006
posted 01-20-2014 03:09 PM
On the 18th frame, do we see the burn-through on the SRB? It seems so but I'm not sure.
dom Member
Posts: 855 From: Registered: Aug 2001
posted 02-19-2019 12:35 PM
This new compilation of cameras covering the 51L launch is tough to watch but fascinating. The director is professional enough to know what's just happened and that he can't give the audience false hope...
posted 02-19-2019 02:25 PM
After 33 years, there's something new to digest. Amazing and sobering.
garyd2831 Member
Posts: 640 From: Syracuse, New York, USA Registered: Oct 2009
posted 02-19-2019 06:55 PM
These videos answered a question I posed a few years back, was there aerial footage and now I know...yes, at least from a helicopter. I wonder if there were any high elevation photos taken of the accident unfolding?
David C Member
Posts: 1015 From: Lausanne Registered: Apr 2012
posted 02-19-2019 11:12 PM
John Young witnessed it from an STA. I may be wrong, but I vaguely remember him saying that he took photos (not film). Might be in "Forever Young" ('course with the errors in that book it wouldn't guarantee that it actually happened). Don't think any other jets were close.
JohnSpaceUK Member
Posts: 43 From: UK Registered: Jan 2016
posted 02-25-2019 09:07 AM
Around 5:30 the bottom right two images appear to show a parachute falling, but the audio says there are no "chutes" in the obiter. Any idea what it is?
Rick Mulheirn Member
Posts: 4167 From: England Registered: Feb 2001
posted 02-25-2019 09:56 AM
Most likely SRB nose cone chutes.
JimSchultze Member
Posts: 17 From: Omaha, NE, USA Registered: Nov 2012
posted 02-25-2019 12:47 PM
quote:Originally posted by JohnSpaceUK: Any idea what it is?
Looks like the drogue chute from the nose cap of one of the SRBs. Here's a good doc on the SRB recovery system.
posted 11-12-2012 12:07 PM
advertisement