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  Combatting modern space hoaxes (flat Earth) (Page 2)

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Author Topic:   Combatting modern space hoaxes (flat Earth)
YankeeClipper
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posted 06-28-2017 07:04 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for YankeeClipper   Click Here to Email YankeeClipper     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by p51:
The historical fact that 12 men walked on the moon isn't an issue of truth or not — it actually happened.
All of us on this forum know that it happened. The issue for the naysayers is the other body of historical facts that strongly suggest to them that it didn't.

Facts such as astronauts are a very small and anomalous human statistical population, and moonwalking astronauts are an even greater statistical anomaly. Facts such as billions of humans have existed and never journeyed to the moon, and that the claimed feat has not been replicated by any other nation.

We can show them all the Lunar Laser Ranging RetroReflector (LRRR) array data and Lunar Reconnaissance Orbiter (LRO) images, but their body of facts support the narrative they espouse.

I honestly don't know if their frame of reference can be expanded to include all the facts, or their perspective enhanced. It is extremely difficult to make somebody accept something that they ideologically and fundamentally do not believe.

oly
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posted 06-28-2017 09:19 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for oly   Click Here to Email oly     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
For some that state the flat earth, moon hoax and other points of view, they do so with a conviction and belief that what they believe to be the truth is fact. You can throw as much science at them as you can find however they will never be swayed from their belief. They have this as their genuine belief.

Others push the same points of view (flat earth etc.) simply to cause a stir, gain attention or make waves. They get satisfaction from winding up an argument or maybe they are just chasing their 15min of fame.

The advent of the internet and forums like this gives them a stage that they can stand on from the confines of their keyboard.

This is not unique to flat earthers or lunar skeptics. You can find countless topics that stir up the same divides.

In many countries this is looked at as healthy, peoples rights or a freedom. Free speech. You don't have to stand on a soap box in Hyde park or frequent a rally to find a view point that many will disagree with.

You can have science on your side and have first hand knowledge or experience. For some this is enough and for others its just fuel for the argument.

For me personally I find it frustrating when I meet someone who believes the moon landings and the Apollo project were a hoax filmed in a studio. Some of the smartest people with good education and a background in engineering or science that are convinced that it was a hoax and seem to always ask "If we really went to the moon how come we don't go now?"

This seems to be becoming more frequent and prevalent as time moves on. As the younger generation who have not lived with the threat of a cold war and who can't comprehend a government that would commit to such a huge investment in time, money and resources.

For me, engaging in and argument with a flat earther or moon hoax "non believer" just seems like a waste of energy and a wrestle with futility that will end up gaining nothing and going nowhere.

If the documented evidence of the Apollo Program, the Earthrise photo, the Apollo 17 blue marble photos, the Apollo 12 retrieved Surveyor camera, the eyewitness accounts, the science, the facts and the graves of heroes that were lost in the great adventure are not enough to convince these people, if the Hubble Deep Field or Pillars of Creation shots don't open their eyes and if standing in Florida watching a rocket blast into the sky doesn't make these people even consider for one moment that the earth is round, the sky is blue, footprints and wheel marks on the moon are real and the other things then I don't feel that it is worth giving such people any endulgment or fuel for their fire.

For me, asking why we don't go to the moon again is frustrating for many reasons. But when a moon landing non-believer uses this question as a defense for their argument, it's like a creationist asking, "If monkeys turned into men before, why don't you see them do it now?"

moorouge
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posted 06-29-2017 02:09 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for moorouge   Click Here to Email moorouge     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Perhaps my "wise man" should have said, "What you believe to be the truth is entirely up to you." It follows, does it not, that if you hold a belief then to you and you alone that is a truth. It is not necessary for that belief (truth) to be related to the real world in any way. What you believe and hold to be true is a very singular and personal assessment of your own interpretation of a given set of information. It really doesn't matter that this information is true in the real sense of the word. As has been pointed out several times, the Apollo hoaxers and flat earthers pay little or no heed to the real world to form their believe and what they hold to be their version of the truth.

So, let me restate it – the wise man was not talking about the real world and the absolute truths and facts that exist in that world. What he was talking about was the thought processes that go on in an individual's brain to formulate a personal assessment and interpretation of those truths and facts. It really is a matter of what you want it to be.

Jim Behling
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posted 06-29-2017 07:58 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Jim Behling   Click Here to Email Jim Behling     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
See: Idiocracy, The Marching Morons.

Lunar rock nut
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posted 06-29-2017 09:37 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Lunar rock nut   Click Here to Email Lunar rock nut     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Slightly stepping aside from this topic but still relating to this concept. Saturday morning while waiting for the news before 5:00 A.M. I was watching the Agricultural Report and The U.S. Ag. Dept. released the results of a nation wide survey and found that 16.4 million people believe chocolate milk actually comes from brown cows. So these are probably the flat earthers and the moon hoaxers relatives. (Stupid is what Stupid does)!

p51
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posted 06-29-2017 01:52 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for p51   Click Here to Email p51     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Bad information is one thing. If you hear that once and never anything to the contrary, well, I can get that. There's countless such things that people "know" without ever being told otherwise.

However, the idea that against all logic, people dismiss the overwhelming scientific fact of a round earth (and/or faked moon landings/space program, etc) and instead decide to pay attention only to the fringe internet 'sources' is spectacularly idiotic.

Ronpur
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posted 06-29-2017 06:30 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Ronpur   Click Here to Email Ronpur     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
In the words of General Anthony Clement McAuliffe to the Germans requesting his surrender at the Battle of the Bulge: "NUTS!"

YankeeClipper
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posted 06-29-2017 10:34 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for YankeeClipper   Click Here to Email YankeeClipper     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I wonder what the flat earth believers and Apollo hoaxers would make of the works of the Belgian surrealist artist René Magritte?

In the Los Angeles County Museum, is Magritte's La Trahison des Images: The Treachery of Images which features an image of a smoking pipe and the words "Ceci n'est pas une pipe" ("This is not a pipe"). As the curator notes:

Magritte's word-image paintings are treatises on the impossibility of reconciling words, images, and objects. La Trahison des Images challenges the linguistic convention of identifying an image of something as the thing itself. At first, Magritte's point appears simplistic, almost to the point of provocation: A painting of a pipe is not the pipe itself. In fact, this work is highly paradoxical.
Apollo hoaxers often argue that photographs of the landings are merely treacherously false reproduced images and are not reality.

In Magritte's Le chef d'oeuvre ou les mystères de l'horizon ("The masterpiece or the mysteries of the horizon") three seemingly identical men each face different directions below a crescent moon, appearing to share the same space however existing in different realities.

The flat earth people might really be challenged by Magritte's Le Grand Style, which features a surrealist spherical earth. There is, indeed, a fine line between genius and insanity!

All this prompted me to speculate if there is a particular subset or cohort of Apollo naysayers who think that flat earth believers are truly barking mad? One can only imagine what the alien abductees think of them!

Even expert psychiatrists and psychologists can misdiagnose as the article Magritte's Mystery and the DSM's Disorders shows.

moorouge
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posted 06-30-2017 02:13 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for moorouge   Click Here to Email moorouge     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Though not an exact analogous story to that of my "wise man," this is close enough to the concept of what I was trying to convey.

This was used by Gerry Spence who was defending Lee Harvey Oswald at his 1986 trial on television.

The bird, like the truth, is in your hands. It is your decision to decide if you accept as true that men walked on the Moon. Equally it is the hoaxers decision, however idiotic it may seem, to accept as true that men didn't walk on the Moon.

YankeeClipper
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posted 06-30-2017 07:51 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for YankeeClipper   Click Here to Email YankeeClipper     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
One thing seems clear from all the viewpoints and interactions that have been shared so far. It is very easy to lump these people into one single category and label them all stupid, idiots, or mad. I know I have been guilty of that as much as anyone.

The clinical reality is that there seems to be a whole spectrum of naysayers from the otherwise intelligent and rational all the way over to completely coco bananas. Some haven't bothered to research anything, or have some facts but not the crucial ones, while others may be delusional, neurochemically imbalanced, or have a structural neurological disorder.

There's an adage that if you think you are arguing with an idiot, so do they! We would look at an Earthrise photograph and think great image, and anyone who says that didn't happen is living in a surreal existence. Apollo hoaxers look at the exact same image and say it is fake, and think that we are the deluded ones in our own surreal fantasy thinking it is real!

To answer the OP, I don't think one single strategy is going to combat the existence and propagation of modern space hoaxes. People will believe what they believe and, sometimes, there is just no way to change that. They may even call you crazy for trying!

Blackarrow
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posted 06-30-2017 11:59 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Blackarrow     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by moorouge:
The bird, like the truth, is in your hands. It is your decision to decide if you accept as true that men walked on the Moon. Equally it is the hoaxers decision, however idiotic it may seem, to accept as true that men didn't walk on the Moon.
I don't agree. If, after 54 years, there is no universally accepted account of the assassination of JFK, I assume there never will be. Any missing evidence or unheard testimony is by now probably lost to history.

In the case of the shape of planet Earth, absolute certainty can easily be demonstrated, leaving absolutely no room for doubt that the Earth is an oblate spheroid. Likewise, there is absolute certainty that Apollo astronauts walked on the Moon (I will not waste time reciting the evidence) but in a few years the means should exist to transport people to the Apollo landing-sites to confirm what most of us already know to be true.

In other words, the evidence is there on the Moon and if there is anyone who doubts this today (out of ignorance, madness or badness) the evidence will still be there in a few years to provide the absolute proof that some people still deny.

The truth is not what someone (whether myself or Bart Sibrel) thinks it is, or wants it to be. The truth is there to be seen. Objectively and permanently.

Robert Pearlman
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posted 06-30-2017 12:15 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Robert Pearlman   Click Here to Email Robert Pearlman     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by YankeeClipper:
...label them all stupid, idiots, or mad.
To clarify my own comments and the use of the word, "ignorant," that wasn't meant as a label or insult, but a state of being.

One can be very intelligent and still be in a state of ignorance. For example, I readily admit that I am ignorant of most professional sports. I'd be hard pressed to cite all the rules, let alone the teams and players.

People who say the Earth is flat or that we didn't land on the moon are ignorant. That doesn't mean they are necessarily "stupid, idiots, or mad"; they could be very well versed on other subjects. It is only their state of being with regards to the subject at hand.

No need for "wise men" or philosophical investigations into why they say such. Regardless the reason, they are ignorant of the facts. And just like my own case with sports, the facts are readily available if I/they desire to learn them.

moorouge
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posted 06-30-2017 02:16 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for moorouge   Click Here to Email moorouge     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Blackarrow:
The truth is not what someone (whether myself or Bart Sibrel) thinks it is, or wants it to be. The truth is there to be seen. Objectively and permanently.

You are wrong. It is about what a person thinks it is. It matters not that the truth is there objectively or permanent, if a person - you, me, Bart Sibrel or anyone else - doesn't accept it as being true, then to them it is not and that becomes their truth.

quote:
Originally posted by Robert Pearlman:
Regardless the reason, they are ignorant of the facts.

In the case of the Apollo hoax believers, many are not ignorant of the facts. They have an atypical interpretation of them that you, and many others, don't happen to agree with.

YankeeClipper
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posted 06-30-2017 03:10 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for YankeeClipper   Click Here to Email YankeeClipper     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
It's a good thing most of the Apollo hoaxers have never heard of Hugh Everett's Many-Worlds Theory (MWT) of parallel universes with different quantum realities and outcomes.

It's hard enough to convince people in this universe without having to contemplate multiple arguments in a multiverse.

The downside is that in at least one of the parallel universes, you have actually become an Apollo skeptic. In another, only the USSR landed men on the moon. In another, no one did.

Of course, the upside is that in at least one of the multiple universes NASA kept flying lunar missions indefinitely and many more of us walked on the moon!

I'll raise a glass to Hugh Everett in salute for that!

moorouge
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posted 07-01-2017 12:58 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for moorouge   Click Here to Email moorouge     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
And that means that in at least one universe there are a lot of people saying, "Oh! I see what he was on about now."

Blackarrow
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posted 07-01-2017 10:37 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Blackarrow     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Eddie, in making the dogmatic statement: "You are wrong" are you not denying me the very right which you accord to every eye-rolling fanatic who claims the Earth is flat, or nobody has been to the Moon, namely the right to "my truth" (as you would put it)?

However, I think you have previously provided the key to concluding this interesting philosophical debate. You have done your best to persuade others that truth is what a person thinks it is, and if someone is convinced against all the evidence that the Earth is flat, then a flat Earth is "their truth." That makes truth subjective, and by definition different for everyone who accepts a different body of evidence. I have previously quoted the dictionary definitions of "truth" and I stand by my assertion, supported by the dictionary, that truth is necessarily objective.

What you are referring to is not truth but opinion. If you would substitute "opinion" where you have previously referred to "truth" then I don't think there is anything to argue about. If Bart Sibrel believes no-one has been to the Moon, I accept that this is his opinion (misguided though it is) and that he is entitled to his own opinion (just as I am entitled to rely on the evidence to ridicule his opinion!).

You appear to have acknowledged the difference between opinion and truth in your post on 29th June when you state: "It is not necessary for that belief (truth) to be related to the real world in any way." You then go on to refer to "...the thought processes that go on in an individual's brain to formulate a personal assessment and interpretation of those truths and facts..." That sounds to me like a good definition of how one arrives at a personal opinion.

Cozmosis22
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posted 07-01-2017 11:29 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Cozmosis22     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Blackarrow:
Any missing evidence or unheard testimony is by now probably lost to history.
Thanks to the notion of a Yeti, the Loch Ness monster, a hollow Earth, the lost advanced civilization of Atlantis, the Roswell alien spaceship crash, the Apollo hoaxers and the JFK conspiracy theorists; there has been cottage industry built upon flawed personal eyewitness accounts, historical coincidences, and wild-eyed speculation which cannot be proven.

While it is interesting and most amusing to read these modern day ghost stories there is no particularly good reason for their existence other than their entertainment value. Those who choose to accept these strange concepts as fact will not be swayed by reality as they are usually way too emotionally invested in their own beliefs to change.

Can usually tell within a few minutes if a logical discussion may lead to a meeting of the minds. Beyond that, arguing with fanatics is futile.

moorouge
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posted 07-01-2017 12:27 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for moorouge   Click Here to Email moorouge     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Blackarrow:
Eddie, in making the dogmatic statement: "You are wrong" are you not denying me the very right which you accord to every eye-rolling fanatic who claims the Earth is flat, or nobody has been to the Moon, namely the right to "my truth" (as you would put it)?

Geoffrey, you are quite right to pull me up over this. I apologise. I should have said, "I don't agree." I wouldn't dare to deny you anything, but you're still wrong. An opinion held is still a truth to that person.

spaced out
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posted 07-01-2017 01:23 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for spaced out   Click Here to Email spaced out     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I have to agree with Blackarrow's take on Moorouge's arguments here. It comes down to a definition of truth: moorouge is using the term as in "their truth" - i.e. what they hold to be true; everyone else is using the term to refer to something which is objectively true. Once you accept that the term is being used in those ways there isn't really any disagreement here.

Also, Robert's use of the term "ignorant" is quite correct as he clarifies it himself. The most intelligent person in the world can be quite ignorant of many (or even most things). I'd even argue that people's ignorance far outweighs their knowledge in almost every area.

If you take even an area where you have specialist knowledge that goes way beyond what the average person on the street holds in that area you will probably find there are more things you don't know about that subject than you do. My own knowledge of space patches or flown artifacts is beyond that of the average person on the street but I'm well aware that there is a vast amount of information on those subjects that I don't know and never will. My ignorance far exceeds my knowledge, even in an area of 'specialist' knowledge.

Blackarrow
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posted 07-04-2017 05:34 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Blackarrow     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
On a slightly different note, I have just spotted a rather interesting raw image recently transmitted by Cassini in orbit around Saturn. I don't really know what it shows, but I suspect it's only a matter of time before the "flat Earth" brigade claim it is some kind of "space ghost." I don't think they would claim it as a "ghost astronaut" since they can't accept that astronauts can get to the Moon, let alone Saturn.

Watch for the torrent of lunacy - you have been warned!

moorouge
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posted 07-05-2017 02:46 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for moorouge   Click Here to Email moorouge     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
This reminds me of a test given the Mercury astronauts (maybe apocryphal) when they were given a blank piece of paper and asked what they could see. I believe one answer was a polar bear in a snow storm.

This said two things spring to mind when looking at the Cassini picture - a white horse but it's more like the kitchen when my partner is cooking.

oly
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posted 07-05-2017 03:00 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for oly   Click Here to Email oly     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
As far as flat Earthers go, because the Earth is flat then there is no way a launched rocket could reach orbital speed on a flat plane, so therefore a spacecraft could not leave orbit to venture out towards another planet because planets could not exist as they could not be in an orbit around the sun and so could not be observed in the night sky. The moon could not be reached because it is in an endless journey along a flat plane westward. So therefore no spacecraft took this photo and so no flat Earther would challenge that this photo exists.

p51
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posted 07-05-2017 10:58 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for p51   Click Here to Email p51     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I fully believe that conspiracy theories have a root in not wanting to accept any personal responsibility. Just like people talking about "The Man" is keeping them down, if everything is a conspiracy, why do any real effort to better yourself or others if there's some force keeping things the way they want? In the case of my Father-In-Law, I firmly believe this is the case. Why bother, if a small group of people (or aliens) is controlling everything that happens to everyone?

They'll just declare that something is a conspiracy, so therefore they can't trust anything that doesn't support that theory. And the internet is a breeding ground for people like this, as they can read/watch only the content that supports their odd theory. If I had a dollar for every time I've heard, "You need to watch [so-and-so's] podcast," to which I usually reply, "Uh, YOU need to pick up a basic book on science." That never goes over well, of course. But like my Mom has always said, I have never suffered fools, even when I was a kid.

The bottom line is that most of these conspiracies are silly in their root, if you just step back and look.

quote:
Originally posted by Cozmosis22:
Those who choose to accept these strange concepts as fact will not be swayed by reality as they are usually way too emotionally invested in their own beliefs to change.
People of that ilk have wrapped themselves in the concept that such fringe thinking cannot be disproven, they leave it up to us to prove that Bigfoot and a flat earth doesn't exist. That is totally opposite of any accepted scientific method, of course.
quote:
Originally posted by Cozmosis22:
Beyond that, arguing with fanatics is futile.
Amen.
quote:
Originally posted by moorouge:
I believe one answer was a polar bear in a snow storm.
Pete Conrad handed the card back and said, "It's upside down." I always snicker every time I think of that.

Blackarrow
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posted 07-05-2017 11:13 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Blackarrow     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
A classic answer, but it might have cost him a seat in a Mercury capsule.

On reflection, that didn't seem to clip his wings too much...

YankeeClipper
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posted 07-05-2017 04:14 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for YankeeClipper   Click Here to Email YankeeClipper     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Pete Conrad's move was pure genius!

moorouge
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posted 07-06-2017 01:57 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for moorouge   Click Here to Email moorouge     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by p51:
That is totally opposite of any accepted scientific method, of course.
The accepted scientific method is for any new research to be published and then reviewed by one's peers. They will either accept it or reject it giving reasons for their decisions.

As far as I'm aware there is nowhere on the internet that this happens with matters involving spaceflight. Both sides are all too often so deeply entrenched in their beliefs that they refuse to even acknowledge that the other exists. It's almost as if both camps are fearful that their reasons why they accept one view or the other won't stand up to the scrutiny of others. Surely it is better to be open and be able to argue your particular viewpoint with those on the other side of the fence. Ignoring them is hardly the way to enlightenment.

Perhaps this is why odd-ball beliefs fester away in the dark corners of the internet.

p51
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posted 07-06-2017 10:32 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for p51   Click Here to Email p51     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Such is the way of the internet, sadly. When nobody has to meet face-to-face (or even know someone's name), people can (and often do) say whatever hurtful and demeaning things as they can think up, with the overall premise that there can be no consequences.

I once had a interaction with a reviled internet troll from a non-space forum at an event years ago, and I was prepared to take this guy out back and give him an attitude adjustment he'd never forget. He'd regularly post to anyone who disagreed with him that he wished horrible things to happen to that person, their families and kids (stuff I wouldn't dream of typing here, even to describe what he meant). But when I got to him, turned out he was just a 14-year-old kid. I did tell him he better not post like that anymore, now that I know who he really is (and would encounter him in the future).

Two of his buddies came up to me later at the event and said that "wasn't cool" because what goes online stays there, they said. I told both of them that real life doesn't work like that.

Robert Pearlman
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posted 07-06-2017 11:48 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Robert Pearlman   Click Here to Email Robert Pearlman     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by moorouge:
The accepted scientific method is for any new research to be published and then reviewed by one's peers.
Peer review precedes publication. The whole point of peer review is to assess the validity of the work before it is put forth. Then, once published, other scientists can validate (or refute) the results by re-staging the experiment (though this is not done as often as it probably should).

dss65
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posted 07-06-2017 08:31 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for dss65   Click Here to Email dss65     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Blackarrow:
A classic answer, but it might have cost him a seat in a Mercury capsule.
I suspect that was just the tip of the iceberg in what was perceived to be insubordination on Conrad's part. What followed would also bear testimony to the decision makers' inability to ignore his incredible competence.

To tie this back to the topic, this reminds me of Buzz Aldrin's Introduction in "Rocket Man," Conrad's biography. Buzz tells about Pete, himself, and their wives attending a Pink Floyd concert at which Pete tries to explain to a guy that there really isn't a "Dark Side of the Moon." When the fellow doesn't seem inclined to believe him, Pete pats him on the shoulder and says, "Trust me. I've been there."

sev8n
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posted 07-07-2017 06:04 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for sev8n     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by p51:
Pete Conrad handed the card back and said, "It's upside down."

I'm no Pete Conrad but that was my first thought when I looked at the Cassini Saturn photo above...

YankeeClipper
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posted 07-26-2017 11:00 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for YankeeClipper   Click Here to Email YankeeClipper     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
For anyone interested in great voyages of discovery, the work of the French Academy of Sciences in the 1730s to prove the shape of the Earth (prolate vs oblate spheroid) makes for fascinating reading. The debate during the Age of Enlightenment occupied some of the finest minds of the day, and involved the ideas of Newton, Descartes, and Cassini among others.

One expedition led by Maupertuis and Celsius went to Lapland, while another led by Godin, La Condamine and Bouguer travelled to Quito (Ecuador). More detail is available here.

As an aside, it is interesting to note that many accepted markers of both the prime parallel and the prime meridian are not quite where they should be!

YankeeClipper
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From: Dublin, Ireland
Registered: Mar 2011

posted 04-26-2018 09:17 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for YankeeClipper   Click Here to Email YankeeClipper     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
This is an excellent thought-provoking article on how people reason, form opinions, make judgements and decisions, and their confidence and ignorance. In it, Steven Sloman, a professor of cognitive science at Brown University, explains group think, cognitive and confirmation bias, preconception, and “the illusion of explanatory depth” - our tendency to overestimate our understanding of how the world works.

Why we pretend to know things, explained by a cognitive scientist

The decisions we make, the attitudes we form, the judgments we make, depend very much on what other people are thinking.

I really do believe that our attitudes are shaped much more by our social groups than they are by facts on the ground. We are not great reasoners. Most people don't like to think at all, or like to think as little as possible. And by most, I mean roughly 70 percent of the population. Even the rest seem to devote a lot of their resources to justifying beliefs that they want to hold, as opposed to forming credible beliefs based only on fact.


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