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Author
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Topic: lunar retrieval mission
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mjanovec
Member Posts: 3811
From: Midwest, USA
Registered: Jul 2005
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posted 11-28-2006 10:22 AM
   
Here's a hypothetical situation: Let's say Apollo 11 lands successfully on the moon and returns to the earth...but then one of the missions that followed it (12, 13, or 14) lands, but due to some problem with the LM, doesn't lift off the lunar surface. Unfortunately, after all attempts are made, the astronauts expire on the lunar surface in LM after running out of supplies.What would have been the most likely response by NASA: 1. Halt all lunar landing missions and end the lunar program.
2. Fix the problem and continue with the remaining missions.
3. Fix the problem and use one of the remaining missions to land at the site of the tragedy in order to retrieve the bodies of the fallen astronauts. Would NASA have risked the lives of a second crew in order to return the bodies? I once read that the opinion was that if astronauts died on the moon, the public would never look at the moon the same way again...knowing there were fallen astronauts still there. (Granted, the earth we stand on has billions of dead people and we tend not to think twice about it.) I guess the same question could probably apply to a crew stranded in lunar orbit. I don't mean this to be a ghoulish topic, but I'm sure there was some thought at NASA about they would respond to such a situation. And perhaps this topic was already addressed here at CS, but I couldn't find it after a quick archive search. |
capcom9
Member Posts: 48
From: Wesley Hills, New York
Registered: Feb 2006
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posted 11-28-2006 12:20 PM
Wow. This sure is a difficult subject to ponder, but one which NASA must have considered during Apollo. As military personnel, would not the government or NASA put in the effort for an astronaut that they would for a soldier who was killed in action?[Edited by capcom9 (November 28, 2006).] |
divemaster
Member Posts: 1376
From: ridgefield, ct
Registered: May 2002
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posted 11-28-2006 01:46 PM
I would guess that #1 would have happened. Too much of a risk to land another LM in the same area. Plus having to lift, stow [in two different vehicles], transport and then splash down with two bodies might have been very rough for everyone. |
Robert Pearlman
Editor Posts: 43576
From: Houston, TX
Registered: Nov 1999
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posted 11-28-2006 01:54 PM
If we take Nixon's prepared comments as an indication, then the departed crew would be left to rest on the Moon: quote:
Fate has ordained that the men who went to the moon to explore in peace will stay on the moon to rest in peace... Others will follow, and surely find their way home. Man's search will not be denied... For every human being who looks up at the moon in the nights to come will know that there is some corner of another world that is forever mankind.
Thus, Nixon paves way for future missions but still infers that the bodies of those who departed would remain on the surface.[Edited by Robert Pearlman (November 28, 2006).] |
Novaspace
Member Posts: 434
From: Tucson, AZ USA
Registered: Sep 2004
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posted 11-28-2006 02:14 PM
...and then the duplicitous Nixon would have quietly cut off funding for Apollo.When asked about the "continuing landings" i can hear him saying "...well I didn"t mean NOW" I think it is poetic justice that the man who killed Apollo didn't outlive many of the astronauts. Kim Poor [Edited by Novaspace (November 28, 2006).] |
DavidH
Member Posts: 1217
From: Huntsville, AL, USA
Registered: Jun 2003
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posted 11-28-2006 03:32 PM
Of course, unless I'm mistaken, those comments were specifically about Apollo 11, and thus are no guarantee that there would have been further missions in the case of a failure. A problem on A11 would have meant that the nation had not yet met the Kennedy goal of "bringing him safely home." I think there would have been more of a push to accomplish a successful mission -- assuming the problem was something for which a clear solution could be found -- if it hadn't been done.------------------
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"America's challenge of today has forged man's destiny of tomorrow." - Commander Eugene Cernan, Apollo 17 Mission, 11 December 1972 |
mjanovec
Member Posts: 3811
From: Midwest, USA
Registered: Jul 2005
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posted 11-28-2006 04:28 PM
quote:
Originally posted by DavidH:
A problem on A11 would have meant that the nation had not yet met the Kennedy goal of "bringing him safely home." I think there would have been more of a push to accomplish a successful mission -- assuming the problem was something for which a clear solution could be found -- if it hadn't been done.
I agree, which is why I worded my question to refer to a flight after A11. If A11 had failed and caused the death of its crew, I suspect the Russian efforts would have continued...likely forcing the American efforts to continue as well. As a side note, I remember one of my teachers in 7th grade telling the class that the Russians still had dead men orbiting the Earth (presumably from failed missions). I didn't know any better at the time and thought it eerie to "know" that dead men were circling overhead. Of course, I later learned that wasn't true at all...but as a 13 year old, it made an impression on me. |
tegwilym
Member Posts: 2331
From: Sturgeon Bay, WI
Registered: Jan 2000
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posted 11-29-2006 03:14 PM
Hmmm....maybe NASA would have said forget it, let's keep flying, but we won't leave orbit. Lets only fly to a place where we can camp out if something can break, lets only fly in daylight.Oh I guess that already happened, but at least the daylight thing is relaxed soon. Tom
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Blackarrow
Member Posts: 3160
From: Belfast, United Kingdom
Registered: Feb 2002
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posted 11-29-2006 06:12 PM
Here's a similar "what if?" question: what if Apollo 13's parachutes had been damaged by the SM explosion and the crew had died on impact with the ocean? Would Apollo 14 have flown the following year? It's really difficult to think of a good reason why not, since the "fix" would have been identical and the desirability of getting Fra Mauro samples would have remained the same. The only difference would have been the deaths of the three astronauts. (I know how that sounds, but I hope you see what I mean). Whether or not Apollo 14 would have flown would, I suppose, have depended on whether NASA and the American public felt they had the stomach to continue in the wake of such a tragedy. As for the original question, I suggest that much would have depended on the nature of the fault. If it was easily fixed, I suggest that there would have been a thorough (and rapid) investigation; the hardware (or software) problem would have been corrected, and Pete Conrad would have commanded Apollo 12 in November, 1969, becoming the first man on the Moon. But with two dead astronauts on the Moon and Kennedy's pledge fulfilled, I suspect NASA would then have called it a day. |
Orthon
Member Posts: 144
From: San Tan Valley, Arizona 85143
Registered: May 2002
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posted 11-29-2006 08:06 PM
The incredible part of all this is that the average American is shocked when the space program claims a life. Apparently they don't realize that there was always risk involved.Every event is viewed as entertainment. |
mjanovec
Member Posts: 3811
From: Midwest, USA
Registered: Jul 2005
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posted 11-29-2006 10:04 PM
quote:
Originally posted by Orthon:
The incredible part of all this is that the average American is shocked when the space program claims a life. Apparently they don't realize that there was always risk involved.Every event is viewed as entertainment.
I think there is a certain amount of shock when anyone doing such a public thing dies...regardless of whether is was a risky venture or not. And accidental death is always shocking, to some degree. Look at the reaction to the death of the Crocodile Hunter. We all knew he took risks, but it was still somewhat of a shock when he died. Not totally unsurprising, but still a bit of a shock. For the most part, the American public has reacted well to the losses of Challenger and Columbia (...I wasn't around for Apollo 1, so I won't comment about that). In fact, support for the space program usually increases after a tragedy like that. |
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