posted 06-04-2017 07:09 AM               

Are the other pictures connected to RR or anywhere else online or are they different angles?

posted 06-04-2017 07:20 AM               

It's possible they printed a high-res copy of the RR listing to try to sell as the original, and took a picture of that... but it does come with that additional Defense Mapping Agency plaque, for provenance. (A plaque which was not mentioned in the original RR listing - and again, the signatures are perfect matches!)

posted 06-04-2017 07:55 AM               

A collector familiar with the dedicated auction houses who paid that kind of money would most likely know that there are better avenues to sell than Craigslist, even if you need money fast.

But short of knowing the details of who bought the piece from RR, all we can do is speculate.

That being said, RR said the piece was pre-certified by Zarelli. Generally speaking, "pre-certification" is based off high res scans, rather than a physical investigation.

If that was the case here, is it possible that multiples of these exist, with the signatures printed on each? Like could there have been a single one presented to the agency (it is dedicated to the Command as a whole, rather an individual) and then duplicated and presented to various individuals? Printed signatures can be tough, if not impossible, to discern in a photograph unless you have something to compare it to.

I'm not familiar with the item, so I could be way off base, but an organization being awarded with a single rare item like that and presenting a copy to the various individuals who made that happen seems plausible.

posted 06-05-2017 06:35 PM               

The plaque and signed survey are supposedly his father's. He was given the signed piece when he retired. He knew the value of the crew signed map and had done his research. Supposedly he had been in touch with RR but insisted upon the fact that the piece was never actually auctioned. He lost me a little there but insisted that he had the survey in hand. He is asking auction prices, but is trying to avoid paying seller fees, hence the listing on Craigslist and not on eBay or another auction site.

For those who could run with those bulls, it might be worth a phone call. He will actually call you back. He sounded amenable to providing better photos and maybe you could even convince him to hold a copy of today's newspaper with it as well!

posted 06-05-2017 11:28 PM               

If I recall correctly, RR's terms grant it the right to bid on behalf of the consignor. Is it possible that the sale price listed is due to RR selling it to itself? Or is it as simple as them listing the highest bids with unmet reserves as a "Sale Price"?

posted 06-06-2017 05:09 PM               

The CL listing pictures appear to be taken by the seller, or at least differ materially from images in the RR listing.

All the signatures look identical in formation to me as well; no way both are uniquely/originally signed.

I'd conclude these are two separate items, with the Craigslist piece being a duplicate of the original map from RR (I'm assuming "live ink" was verified by RR). As mentioned, prints of signed items can be difficult to discern from original for most folks, even with the item in front of them.

Also sense the original used an applied label for the descriptive autograph area but can't tell from either image set.

Perhaps a vintage copy, and part of his father's collection from time with the U.S. Army Topographic Command (thus the additional plaque)?

Seems clear the RR description was used but seller acknowledges awareness of RR so maybe verbiage was simply "borrowed" to dress up the Craigslist posting.

(RR item left, CL item right; click to enlarge.)

posted 06-07-2017 08:26 PM               

quote:

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Originally posted by navyflyer1127:
So then general consensus is that the craigslist ad is a high quality copy then?

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Yes.

quote:

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Originally posted by navyflyer1127:
Would there be any value in a replica?

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Yes. It's a nice display piece.