|
Author
|
Topic: FS: Extensive spaceflight memorabilia collection
|
spaceuk
Member Posts: 2113
From: Staffs, UK
Registered: Aug 2002
|
posted 05-17-2013 10:10 AM
  
Since 1963 — after 50 years of writing spaceflight articles and news reports for magazines, newspapers and radio and presenting spaceflight talks to hundreds and hundreds of UK audiences and organising and presenting several major spaceflight exhibitions in UK museums and even once at NASA Kennedy Space Center to help in the exploration and utilisation of space for humanity — I am having to "retire" from these activities because of deteriorating eye sight as I enter my twilight years!Reluctantly — very reluctantly — I am having to sell my extensive spaceflight collection collected over those 50 years before I finally lose my sight. I have produced a Spaceflight Sale List that shows the items I have for sale including many space flown items, lunar landed items, astronaut autographs, Apollo and shuttle manuals, Russian items and a host of other space items even a few Shenzhou related pieces! I am offering this list to collectSPACE members for the next few weeks and because the members here have deep interests and support for spaceflight they are probably one of the best audiences to give a good home to these items. As such, I am offering discounts on multi items (see listing for details) to collectSPACE members for the next few weeks. After that period, any unsold items will need go to auction and, of course, prices are likely to be higher and no discounts given! The Spaceflight Items For Sale List (PDF format) is available from Google Drive. If you have any problem downloading the list, then email me at spaceuk@gmail.com and I can send you a PDF copy via email. I have given prices in the listing but you are welcome to submit any reasonable and sensible offer for any item and I will consider it though may not accept it. But, we can haggle!  Incidentally I wrote many of the Apollo news items in the mid 60s/early 70s for British Interplanetary Society magazine "Spaceflight" and also did many major Apollo articles like "Aspects of Apollo", Apollo 8, Apollo 11 "Man On The Moon" and Apollo 13 as well as detailed articles on the Apollo Onboard Computer, lunar rovers and Hasselblad cameras — in a era when no internet or mobiles or YouTube! Several articles are listed in NASA Apollo Bibliography and on Apollo Lunar Surface Journal (ALSJ).
I hope to keep reading and participating at spaceflight sites for as long as eye sight will allow. — Phill Parker |
Philip
Member Posts: 5952
From: Brussels, Belgium
Registered: Jan 2001
|
posted 05-17-2013 10:57 AM
All the best! Apollo Lunar Surface Journal: Phill Parker
|
Charlie16
Member Posts: 494
From: Italy
Registered: Dec 2010
|
posted 05-17-2013 11:17 AM
Email sent. |
davidcwagner
Member Posts: 799
From: Albuquerque, New Mexico
Registered: Jan 2003
|
posted 05-17-2013 02:31 PM
Email sent for Item 40. Other emails to follow. |
NeilPearson
Member Posts: 147
From: UK
Registered: May 2013
|
posted 05-17-2013 02:43 PM
Email sent for 0858 |
rgarner
Member Posts: 1193
From: Shepperton, United Kingdom
Registered: Mar 2012
|
posted 05-17-2013 03:02 PM
Email sent regarding item 21. |
rgarner
Member Posts: 1193
From: Shepperton, United Kingdom
Registered: Mar 2012
|
posted 05-17-2013 03:23 PM
Another email regarding a few more items just sent off. |
davidcwagner
Member Posts: 799
From: Albuquerque, New Mexico
Registered: Jan 2003
|
posted 05-17-2013 03:50 PM
Sent two more emails with list of items. I assume first come, first serve. Thanks. |
vidoz
Member Posts: 82
From: Italy
Registered: Aug 2011
|
posted 05-17-2013 04:43 PM
Email sent. |
Robert Pearlman
Editor Posts: 42987
From: Houston, TX
Registered: Nov 1999
|
posted 05-17-2013 04:52 PM
FYI: Phill had me post the original for sale notice for him and therefore may not be checking this thread. So replying that you sent an e-mail may go unchecked. Best to just e-mail him. |
Rick Mulheirn
Member Posts: 4167
From: England
Registered: Feb 2001
|
posted 05-17-2013 05:54 PM
I acquired some stuff from Phil nearly 30 years ago. A good guy to deal with. |
vidoz
Member Posts: 82
From: Italy
Registered: Aug 2011
|
posted 05-17-2013 09:19 PM
quote:
Originally posted by Robert Pearlman:
FYI: Phill had me post the original for sale notice for him and therefore may not be checking this thread. So replying that you sent an e-mail may go unchecked. Best to just e-mail him.
Thanks for letting us know, Robert! |
LateApex
Member Posts: 44
From: Chicago
Registered: Oct 2012
|
posted 05-17-2013 10:03 PM
Great collection. Email sent on a number of items. |
YankeeClipper
Member Posts: 617
From: Dublin, Ireland
Registered: Mar 2011
|
posted 05-17-2013 10:35 PM
E-mail sent for items 0049 and 0457. |
space-coins
Member Posts: 118
From: Germany
Registered: Aug 2009
|
posted 05-18-2013 01:53 AM
Great collection! I have sent you an email regarding items #45 and #248. |
spaced out
Member Posts: 3110
From: Paris, France
Registered: Aug 2003
|
posted 05-18-2013 06:39 AM
Am I being naive to suggest that if Phill has seriously underestimated the value of a particular piece fellow collectors might like to point out the error and make a reasonable offer approaching it's true value rather than grabbing it and running?I contacted Phill this morning to make an offer on one item only to find it sold last night for £25 when its true value was many hundreds of dollars, as the buyer is certainly aware. The buyer has effectively robbed Phill of the hundreds of dollars he would have got for these items if he'd just waited a little longer or put the items up for sale on eBay or in any other auction format. Although it's obviously legal, I believe it's morally wrong and highly disrespectful to take advantage of a fellow collector's lack of knowledge in this way. |
JasonB
Member Posts: 1091
From:
Registered: Sep 2003
|
posted 05-18-2013 08:22 AM
I just saw this so I'm sure I missed most of the deals but most of what I saw was fairly priced. There were some anomalies that made me look twice but maybe he just wants to sell them quickly? Also if you list 1,000 things at once you're probably going to make a mistake or two on price. That's life.Saying anyone is being ripped off is wrong. I'm sure he'll be happy selling things and being paid so quickly (as opposed to an auction), and someone got a deal. Sometimes both parties get exactly what they want. |
george9785
Member Posts: 196
From: Burnaby, BC, Canada
Registered: Nov 2010
|
posted 05-18-2013 09:17 AM
Chris, if you're referring to item # 82, it should have been apparent to anyone knowledgeable that that was simply a clerical error and not an ill-informed valuation if one bases that conclusion on the majority of Phill's other prices for this sale. No one should hold Phill to that error nor should Phill be bound by it. |
gliderpilotuk
Member Posts: 3398
From: London, UK
Registered: Feb 2002
|
posted 05-18-2013 10:06 AM
quote:
Originally posted by spaced out:
Although it's obviously legal, I believe it's morally wrong and highly disrespectful to take advantage of a fellow collector's lack of knowledge in this way.
Well it wouldn't be the first time items have been "recycled" following a (more than) fair price sale on cS! Sadly the "free market" argument always outweighs decency and rectitude. I, too have made a "market price" offer on a couple of under-priced items, as they are items I'd cherish rather than recycle. If Phill needs the cash then HE should be the beneficiary of proceeds from this fine collection, not some opportunistic reseller. However it's his call at the end of the day: we can only watch on and mark those who sell stuff on.
|
spaced out
Member Posts: 3110
From: Paris, France
Registered: Aug 2003
|
posted 05-18-2013 11:01 AM
quote:
Originally posted by george9785:
Chris, if you're referring to item # 82, it should have been apparent to anyone knowledgeable that that was simply a clerical error and not an ill-informed valuation if one bases that conclusion on the majority of Phill's other prices for this sale. No one should hold Phill to that error nor should Phill be bound by it.
Indeed it was item #82 I was referring to. Apparently Phill didn't realize the appeal of these unflown items of crew equipment and thought £25 was a reasonable price. Obviously in reality these are very rare items which are worth serious money to keen collectors. It would have been nice for collectors to have had a chance to acquire them and to have had Phill receive something approaching their true value. |
george9785
Member Posts: 196
From: Burnaby, BC, Canada
Registered: Nov 2010
|
posted 05-18-2013 11:34 AM
Well, if it wasn't a clerical error, then I'd say there is no foul. We do this all the time on eBay with BIN's (Buy It Now's), flea markets, garage sales, or what have you. It's one thing when collectors, particularly those who are registered here, contact naive sellers to change eBay listings from auctions to BIN's for them or to sell to them privately for well below value, which I equate to theft, but to take advantage of situations like this where the seller "designed" his own sale and, without interference from others, set his own prices isn't so bad. In my mind too it's just as bad or worse for a Johnny-come-lately (who knows an item is likely already sold because it was such a bargain) to try and undue a transaction by changing the terms of sale by offering more money for a "sold" item, particularly if the person doing this has deeper pockets than the original purchaser. |
gliderpilotuk
Member Posts: 3398
From: London, UK
Registered: Feb 2002
|
posted 05-18-2013 11:44 AM
No-one ever implied that there was any post-sale up-bidding going on, so it's a moot point.  |
vidoz
Member Posts: 82
From: Italy
Registered: Aug 2011
|
posted 05-18-2013 03:59 PM
quote:
Originally posted by spaced out:
...its true value was many hundreds of dollars, as the buyer is certainly aware.
In my opinion, Phill is fully aware that he is offering items at great prices, as he already stressed that he wanted to give a good home to these items. And, to do so, he is offering discounts as well. Just to incentivise sales.
Furthermore, he also clearly advised that "any unsold items will need to go to auction and, of course, prices are likely to be higher," thus clearly showing not only to be fully aware that he is offering those items at great prices but also that selling prices would be higher at auction. Hence, it has been a free and aware choice to sell them at those prices instead of auctioning them. Moreover, we absolutely do not know if the buyer was aware of the actual value of the item #82. I myself wanted to purchase those tools (not knowing that they had already been sold) but in the end I cancelled them from my list because I usually do not collect this kind of items and thought they had no value, above all considering that nothing has been stated about their provenance. So, just like me, other collectors too could be not aware of their true value. For all we know, the buyer might be in good faith being, for instance, a new collector or even a collector not well informed about prices. We always have to give the benefit of the doubt. We really do not know if the buyer was "certainly aware", as stated, of the true value of those items. I understand that Chris might be very disappointed by having lost the chance to buy those tools but, in the light of what I have just said, stating that the buyer "has effectively robbed Phill of hundreds of dollars" appears to be a very harsh assessment, and so is to say that it is morally wrong and highly disrespectful. Indeed, on the one hand, Phill has proven to be fully aware of what he is doing, so we should not treat him as an unwary seller. On the other hand, we do not have any proof that the buyer was in bad faith. I myself offered more than the asking price for a couple of items (and for another one even much more), as I was thinking them to be underpriced, but then found them to be already sold for the original price. Nonetheless, I feel neither the buyer nor, even more so, the seller is to blame. That is how the market goes. |
JasonB
Member Posts: 1091
From:
Registered: Sep 2003
|
posted 05-18-2013 04:30 PM
No, it was just implied that the seller had been ripped off and was not knowledgeable enough to even know what he's doing or how to price items. All of which is ridiculous and pretty insulting to the seller and the buyer.And I agree with Vidoz. It does seem to just be sour grapes about not getting something. There's no victim or villain here at all so why even bring up this foolishness? |
spaced out
Member Posts: 3110
From: Paris, France
Registered: Aug 2003
|
posted 05-18-2013 05:15 PM
You're right that I should give the buyer the benefit of the doubt, although on a site such as this it's highly likely the buyer did recognize the scissors and flashlight as rare items.Discounts and quick sales I understand, but selling a lot worth several hundred dollars for $39 clearly implies the seller did not realize its true value. I don't see it as insulting to the seller to suggest such a thing. Even the astronauts themselves often have no idea of the current value of particular items in their collections. You can't expect them, or any other individual, to be experts in every area of collecting. That's why sometimes it's up to other collectors to correct people's estimates. If a NASA retiree came on cS and said they had an old Armstrong uninscribed signed photo to sell and 'would anyone like it for $50?' a collector could fire off an email and grab it at that price. I guess there's actually many here who would do just that and feel not a pinch of guilt at having done so. However, I'd like to think that many more collectors would prefer to let the seller know that in fact their Armstrong SP was very valuable and recommend they ask much more or put it up for auction to get the best price. |
JasonB
Member Posts: 1091
From:
Registered: Sep 2003
|
posted 05-18-2013 05:46 PM
No, I would wager that in the completely fictitious case of a retired NASA employee selling an Armstrong on here for $50 that most of the people on here would simply let him know privately in an email instead of claiming that he'd been bamboozled by some sort of criminal on his own thread trying to sell his items, with no proof or knowledge of what actually happened.I would also wager that even if this fictitious person said they didn't care and insisted someone take it for $50 they'd still insist he was robbed, cheated, railroaded or simply to stupid to know what he's doing and he needs someone to take care of him and maybe they'll make him a "fair" offer because they're such a great person? My belief is how bout we just wait til we have actual proof of someone being swindled before we just jump on here and say it happened? I mean how would you feel if you were simply trying to sell stuff on here and someone jumped on screaming "You got ripped off!" Just my point of view. |
Greggy_D
Member Posts: 977
From: Michigan
Registered: Jul 2006
|
posted 05-18-2013 06:24 PM
quote:
Originally posted by spaced out:
You're right that I should give the buyer the benefit of the doubt, although on a site such as this it's highly likely the buyer did recognize the scissors and flashlight as rare items.
And the seller, on a site such as this, is highly likely he should have recognized the same. Especially since he has been involved in this trade since the 60's.I would not begin to try and telegraph his thoughts. |
Bill Nelson
Member Posts: 151
From: Lakewood, Colorado U.S.A.
Registered: Jul 2006
|
posted 05-18-2013 06:34 PM
Maybe he simply is wanting to make some items available at good prices so others can enjoy them, and is not trying to get as much as he possibly can for them. |
Robert Pearlman
Editor Posts: 42987
From: Houston, TX
Registered: Nov 1999
|
posted 05-18-2013 06:51 PM
Let's all stop speculating. As mentioned before Phill did not post the original message on this thread and for all I know is not reading the comments here.If you are truly interested in what Phill intended to do, please e-mail him. He is responding to e-mails (I heard from his twice today that he's been swamped by requests). |
fredtrav
Member Posts: 1673
From: Birmingham AL
Registered: Aug 2010
|
posted 05-18-2013 09:08 PM
I bought several items from Phill though not 82. I had like Vidoz considered them. I thought they were a rather neat group of items but since they are not in what I collect I opted to save my money to spend on other items. I did not realize their value. I did let Phill know of one item I thought was under priced but he said the price was correct.I hope the items are being sold to people who will appreciate them and keep them for their collections, and not just try to make money off them, though of course that is the right of the buyer. |
nasamad
Member Posts: 2121
From: Essex, UK
Registered: Jul 2001
|
posted 05-19-2013 06:31 AM
I contacted Phill when I saw the prices of some of his items and pointed this out to him and he did reply. To quote Phill's reply "undervalued on purpose so that the true collectors of space memorabilia had a chance at obtaining them Hence why I posted to collectSPACE and NASASpaceflight forum." Phill could have easily approached dealers first and obtained higher prices but purposely chose to give us collectors a chance to add to our collections. |
vidoz
Member Posts: 82
From: Italy
Registered: Aug 2011
|
posted 05-19-2013 08:28 AM
As already said, I offered more than the asking price for three items because, I told Phill, I thought them to be underpriced.I got a reply from him, yesterday evening, stating that (his own words): "Prices were pitched to entice spaceflight collectors - hence why I try sell to true space enthusiasts like yourself rather than "others"". A great guy, who is determined to give anyone (not only the same old and voracious "deep pockets") the chance to add interesting or even valuable items to their own collections, as a gesture of solidarity to us fellow collectors, so that even those who cannot afford to spend huge sums have the chance to own a great item for once. Thank you so much, Phill! |
rgarner
Member Posts: 1193
From: Shepperton, United Kingdom
Registered: Mar 2012
|
posted 05-19-2013 08:41 AM
quote:
Originally posted by vidoz:
A great guy, who is determined to give anyone (not only the same old and voracious "deep pockets") the chance to add interesting or even valuable items to their own collections, as a gesture of solidarity to us fellow collectors, so that even those who cannot afford to spend huge sums have the chance to own a great item for once.
Here here! |
cfreeze79
Member Posts: 455
From: Herndon, VA, USA
Registered: Nov 2000
|
posted 05-19-2013 11:27 AM
I am glad your e-mails are getting replied to - because I have not heard a peep regarding the ones I have sent. I do understand that he has been "slammed" but I would like to know that he is even getting my e-mails... -CF |
rgarner
Member Posts: 1193
From: Shepperton, United Kingdom
Registered: Mar 2012
|
posted 05-19-2013 11:38 AM
I haven't had a reply either - patience is a virtue. |
dogcrew5369
Member Posts: 750
From: Statesville, NC
Registered: Mar 2009
|
posted 05-19-2013 11:40 AM
Why is he not listing the items here? My computer won't download the list and the email response is slow. Unfortunately many items I might want to speak for will probably be gone by the time I see the list. Why not copy and paste it here for all to see and get a fair chance I getting an item. Just saying. |
prpro
Member Posts: 86
From: Hope, NJ USA
Registered: Mar 2013
|
posted 05-19-2013 11:41 AM
This is the email Phill sent out yesterday: Firstly, thank you for responding in magnificent fashion to the Spaceflight Items Sale. I was absolutely overwhelmed for quite a few hours — still am!Any e-mail you sent since listing went "LIVE" yesterday (17 May 2013) until 1300 UK time on Saturday 18 May 2013 have been received and they are receiving attention. I can say that majority people have been successful in obtaining items they requested to buy with just a few where items have already been sold. I will be replying by email to everyone who is buying with an email that lists what they have been successful in obtaining over the next few days. I hope to get these out by Wednesday 22nd May 2013 — at very very latest Friday 24th May 2013. If you have not heard from me by Friday 10pm email me and I will check. But, as I have said hope you all get a listing by Wednesday. The reason for the delay is that I was completely and utterly inundated and swamped by requests for over 24 hours until just about a hour ago! A BIG THANK YOU to everyone who replied so far. With just under 1000 items in the sale list it is quite an effort to cross check what is available/what is sold - but it is under control. I have a printed list in date/time order of all emails received from buyers. Again, your perseverance is appreciated and I will be in touch by Wednesday for those whose emails reached me by 1300 hours UK time today (which is over 98% of you!) Those emails received after that time are receiving attention and being checked against items still available and again you will receive an email listing what you have "gained" by Friday next week. Thanks again and will be in touch... Phill Parker |
prpro
Member Posts: 86
From: Hope, NJ USA
Registered: Mar 2013
|
posted 05-19-2013 11:42 AM
quote:
Originally posted by dogcrew5369:
Why is he not listing the items here?
The list is 111 pages long, so it couldn't be pasted here. If you want me to email you a copy, let me know. |
rgarner
Member Posts: 1193
From: Shepperton, United Kingdom
Registered: Mar 2012
|
posted 05-19-2013 12:27 PM
quote:
Originally posted by prpro:
This is the email Phill sent out yesterday...
Thanks, but the fact that I did not receive the emails is a concern in itself - I've had it before where I have missed out due to my emails not being received. Adding to that, I was one of the first to email Phil and most others seem to have had a response. I will send an email from a different address just to be sure. But thanks for the info. |
cfreeze79
Member Posts: 455
From: Herndon, VA, USA
Registered: Nov 2000
|
posted 05-19-2013 12:42 PM
Ditto on the thanks - I fall into the same boat (early e-mail - no response), so I am naturally feeling a touch left out. Just a simple confirmation would be nice... |
advertisement