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Author Topic:   Von Braun engeneers
Dirk
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Posts: 933
From: Belgium
Registered: Jul 2003

posted 10-27-2005 09:01 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Dirk   Click Here to Email Dirk     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Heloo

I am looking for a photo of the following Von Braun engeneers :

Helmut Kräuse
Heinz Hilten
Hans Kennel
Adolf K Thiel

Thanks

Dirk

eurospace
Member

Posts: 2610
From: Brussels, Belgium
Registered: Dec 2000

posted 10-27-2005 02:20 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for eurospace   Click Here to Email eurospace     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Dirk,

Helmut "Kräuse" is Helmut Krause, and I think he is deceased. Also Adolf K Thiel is deceased.

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Jürgen P Esders
Berlin, Germany
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Astroaddies

Dirk
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Posts: 933
From: Belgium
Registered: Jul 2003

posted 10-27-2005 04:41 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Dirk   Click Here to Email Dirk     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
indeed Jürgen, but I still am looking for their photos...

Dirk

Philip
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Posts: 5952
From: Brussels, Belgium
Registered: Jan 2001

posted 11-01-2005 06:20 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Philip   Click Here to Email Philip     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Not sure if official individual portraits were made of those engineers ?

spaceuk
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Posts: 2113
From: Staffs, UK
Registered: Aug 2002

posted 11-01-2005 10:41 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for spaceuk     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Will they not appear on the 'famous' Fort Worth photo with von Braun and the "V-2" in the frame?

Close up single person photos may be harder come by?

eurospace
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Posts: 2610
From: Brussels, Belgium
Registered: Dec 2000

posted 11-01-2005 11:09 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for eurospace   Click Here to Email eurospace     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Krause, Kennel were not part of the original von Braun group. They are the 3rd generation of German rocket pioneers to come to Huntsville. Kennel for instance came to the US in 1956.

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Jürgen P Esders
Berlin, Germany
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Astroaddies

Dirk
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Posts: 933
From: Belgium
Registered: Jul 2003

posted 11-01-2005 02:37 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Dirk   Click Here to Email Dirk     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
It may be a unofficial photo, as long as they are individual. Only a few can be found.
So I found Helmut Gröttrupp in the book his wife published about their time in Russia, and Dieter Huzel on the backside of his book "Peenemunde to Canaveral".
At this moment I am reading "The mare's nest" of David Irving, a classic about this subject, but it has no suitable photos.
(copying is allowed in several occasions...)

Dirk

eurospace
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Posts: 2610
From: Brussels, Belgium
Registered: Dec 2000

posted 11-04-2005 09:00 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for eurospace   Click Here to Email eurospace     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Dirk,

David Irving is of course an imfamous Nazi author who denies that Auschwitz ever took place ... not exactly a good source, I think.

I think Michael Neufeld from the Smithsonian wrote an excellent book about the Peenemündians - The Rocket and the Reich. It is very well researched, historically sound, and a good read too. I think a pocket book edition is also available. Check it out ...

------------------
Jürgen P Esders
Berlin, Germany
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Astroaddies

Dirk
Member

Posts: 933
From: Belgium
Registered: Jul 2003

posted 11-04-2005 06:14 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Dirk   Click Here to Email Dirk     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I close any discussion, as I only look for individual photos.

Dirk

eurospace
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Posts: 2610
From: Brussels, Belgium
Registered: Dec 2000

posted 11-05-2005 08:59 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for eurospace   Click Here to Email eurospace     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Dirk,

The administrator of this bulletin board closes a discussion.

You can find more information about the Irving case and his trial in London here: http://www.guardian.co.uk/irving/0,2759,181044,00.html

In respect to imagery, the American edition of Ernst Stuhlinger's memoirs has a 2nd volume that contains nothing BUT images. You might find the one or the other treasure there.

------------------
Jürgen P Esders
Berlin, Germany
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Astroaddies

eurospace
Member

Posts: 2610
From: Brussels, Belgium
Registered: Dec 2000

posted 11-18-2005 03:41 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for eurospace   Click Here to Email eurospace     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Dirk,

British revisionist David Irving (67) has just been arrested in Austria. The Minister of the Interior confirmed that Irving had been arrested in Styria on 11 November based on an arrest warrant by the Vienna District Court. The denial of the Nazi crimes is a criminal offence in Austria. The arrest warrant had been in force since 1989.

------------------
Jürgen P Esders
Berlin, Germany
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Astroaddies

FFrench
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Posts: 3161
From: San Diego
Registered: Feb 2002

posted 11-18-2005 03:53 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for FFrench     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Glad to hear Irving has been arrested. Jürgen makes a very good point: we all need to be very careful that our sources are good ones. Any "historian" who denies the Holocaust ever took place should be treated extremely suspiciously as a source on Nazi-era history (and any other history, for that matter). A court of appeal in the UK upheld a libel trial ruling "branding him a racist Holocaust denier who deliberately distorted historical facts. "

FF

spaceuk
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Posts: 2113
From: Staffs, UK
Registered: Aug 2002

posted 11-18-2005 04:37 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for spaceuk     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Just seeing if anyone was 'awake' !

Fort Worth should read Fort Bliss

The image of von Braun and Peenemunde engineers is here:-
http://liftoff.msfc.nasa.gov/Academy/History/vonBraun/FortBliss-large.gif


Phill
spaceuk

spaceuk
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From: Staffs, UK
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posted 11-18-2005 04:52 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for spaceuk     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I've autographed envelopes from all but Hilten. I don't think there are photos with these but I'll check them tomorrow.

Phill
UK

karlitko
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Posts: 87
From: Czech Republic
Registered: Aug 2005

posted 11-18-2005 07:09 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for karlitko   Click Here to Email karlitko     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Nov. 17, 2005
Historian arrested on Holocaust denial charges
By ASSOCIATED PRESS
quote:
Right-wing British historian David Irving, who once famously said that Adolf Hitler knew nothing about systematic slaughter of six million Jews, has been arrested in Austria on warrant accusing him of denying Holocaust.

Irving, 67, was detained November 11 in southern province of Styria on warrant issued in 1989 under Austrian laws that make Holocaust denial crime, police Maj. Rudolf Gollia, spokesman for Interior Ministry, said Thursday.


Read the full article here.

[This message has been edited by collectSPACE Admin (edited November 18, 2005).]

Dirk
Member

Posts: 933
From: Belgium
Registered: Jul 2003

posted 11-19-2005 10:02 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Dirk   Click Here to Email Dirk     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Irving wrote "The Mare's Nest" about 40 years ago. Long before he became a "denier".
Those who read that book, can only confirm it is till today one of the best and most detailed works about the V1, V2 and V3 weapons, it tells the fight for the power in Germany, and the way how England became aware of the danger, and how they fought against it and could destroy it.
The book is historically correct and detailed. He also wrote how many prisoners died in terrible circomstances building the V weapons. So just read the book.
And I don't care what Irving is today. I am just interested in the history of that time.
Other very interesting books are "From Peenemunde to Canaveral" (Dieter Huzel) and "The Shadow of Sputnik" (Irmgard Gröttrup).
But thanks anyway for the information about Irving (I won't let my sleep for it
But I still don't find individual portraits of a lot of them....

Dirk

Bob M
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Posts: 1746
From: Atlanta-area, GA USA
Registered: Aug 2000

posted 11-19-2005 11:39 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Bob M   Click Here to Email Bob M     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by spaceuk:

I've autographed envelopes from all but Hilten. I don't think there are photos with these but I'll check them tomorrow.

Phill
UK


Hello Phill,

I noticed that you collect autographs of the von Braun Team. Please contact me about this. Thanks. Bob Mc.

spaceuk
Member

Posts: 2113
From: Staffs, UK
Registered: Aug 2002

posted 11-26-2005 09:38 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for spaceuk     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Dirk

I'm just reading a new book about pre-WWII rocket development in Europe based on papers and diary's by Riedel. These papers were 'locked away' in a museum after Riedel wrote them while he worked at UK Westcott RPE but couldn't get them published. Although a large number of pages are to do with Riedel's involvement with Max Valier ('rocket car')there are quite a number of pages devoted to the A3,A4,A5 vehicles including some photos of original drawings and some computer reworked drawings based on original drawings. Some of these I have not seen before like test stand drawings, rudder schematic,gyro system and so on.

A good book for anyone interested in German "A-rockets" is a book in German called "Raketenforschung in Deutschland" by Dr-ing Gerhard Reising. Fulll of interesting photos and details.


Phill
spaceuk

spaceuk
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Posts: 2113
From: Staffs, UK
Registered: Aug 2002

posted 11-26-2005 09:41 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for spaceuk     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Dirk

I looked for the photos with autographs I have but there weren't any. Sorry !

I may have a image on CD somewhere of Thiel when it was published alongside his obituary
If I locate it I'll email it.

Have you asked Huntsville Times Photo Dept if they may have any photos of these people?

Phill
spaceuk

eurospace
Member

Posts: 2610
From: Brussels, Belgium
Registered: Dec 2000

posted 11-26-2005 10:59 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for eurospace   Click Here to Email eurospace     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by spaceuk:
A good book for anyone interested in German "A-rockets" is a book in German called "Raketenforschung in Deutschland" by Dr-ing Gerhard Reising. Fulll of interesting photos and details.


Phill
spaceuk


Gerhard H. R. Reisig
- Raketenforschung in Deutschland: wie die Menschen das All eroberten, Edition Lenser, Münster 1997, 3-89019-500-8

------------------
Jürgen P Esders
Berlin, Germany
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Astroaddies

Dirk
Member

Posts: 933
From: Belgium
Registered: Jul 2003

posted 11-27-2005 04:03 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Dirk   Click Here to Email Dirk     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I was visiting Hendon RAF museum yesterday.
Will post detail photos of the A4 soon.

Dirk

RocketmanRob
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Posts: 268
From: New York City USA
Registered: Mar 2005

posted 11-29-2005 09:53 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for RocketmanRob   Click Here to Email RocketmanRob     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Folks-

I'm enjoying reading your messages regarding the Von Braun team. I've been very interested in starting to acquire some of the team's signatures as well, but don't have a good sense of where to start. I haven't seen any references regarding where these folks might be contacted. Any suggestions you could provide would be great.

Thanks,

Rob

eurospace
Member

Posts: 2610
From: Brussels, Belgium
Registered: Dec 2000

posted 11-30-2005 01:24 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for eurospace   Click Here to Email eurospace     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Rob,

Only less than a dozen of those old folks are still alive.

You find there addresses in my address list (also see Resources on this site).

------------------
Jürgen P Esders
Berlin, Germany
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Astroaddies

RocketmanRob
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Posts: 268
From: New York City USA
Registered: Mar 2005

posted 12-01-2005 08:48 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for RocketmanRob   Click Here to Email RocketmanRob     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Jurgen-

Thanks for the info. Is your address list posted on the website contained at the bottom of your post?

Thanks,

Rob

eurospace
Member

Posts: 2610
From: Brussels, Belgium
Registered: Dec 2000

posted 12-02-2005 12:34 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for eurospace   Click Here to Email eurospace     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Rob,

The Yahoo group primarily serves to post address changes and to share information about the addresses used.

The list itself is at $19.50 for surface delivery, $30 for airmail shipping.

You'll get an order form upon joining my group (which of course is free of charge) .. ;-)

------------------
Jürgen P Esders
Berlin, Germany
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Astroaddies

eurospace
Member

Posts: 2610
From: Brussels, Belgium
Registered: Dec 2000

posted 02-20-2006 07:36 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for eurospace   Click Here to Email eurospace     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Self-taught "historian" and Holocaust denier David Irving was just sentenced to three years prison in Austria for his denying the destruction of the Jews.

------------------
Jürgen P Esders
Berlin, Germany
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Astroaddies

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