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Author
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Topic: Early Apollo CSM configuration for lunar landings
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History Discussion
Member Posts: 15
From: Bay Area, California
Registered: Feb 2015
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posted 05-29-2015 02:13 AM
   
The original 1961 direct ascent approach for the lunar missions proposed that the Apollo CSM be utilized as a lunar lander with an extra stage added on the back of the Service Module. Does anyone know how the astronauts were suppose to egress from the CSM to the lunar surface? Obviously a long lander was to be used. But the astronauts when landing would be laying on their backs with the exit hatch positioned over their heads. Was there ever a proposal for a second exit hatch for lunar excursions to be positioned at the feet of the astronauts and to be accessed via the Lower Equipment Bay? |
Headshot
Member Posts: 891
From: Vancouver, WA, USA
Registered: Feb 2012
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posted 05-29-2015 07:09 AM
This is an excellent question and applies to the Apollo spacecraft that would have flown an EOR mission to the moon as well.I have reviewed some contemporary NASA literature from prior to the LOR decision and cannot determine the method by which astronauts would have actually descended to the lunar surface. One conceptual drawing just shows space-suited astronauts on the lunar surface next to a large (65 foot tall) Apollo-type CSM/lunar lander. There is another illustration, almost the same picture, that hints of a ladder. I believe that the long climb back up that ladder, after several hours of energy-draining lunar exploration, would not have been fun ... or safe. Another drawing suggests that the spacecraft land on its side, so the exit hatch is closer to the lunar surface. I'll be interested to read what other cSers have to contribute. |
Tykeanaut
Member Posts: 2216
From: Worcestershire, England, UK.
Registered: Apr 2008
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posted 05-29-2015 08:15 AM
It would surely have been difficult to take-off from the lunar surface if it had landed on its side? |
Headshot
Member Posts: 891
From: Vancouver, WA, USA
Registered: Feb 2012
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posted 05-29-2015 08:41 AM
Probably more inefficient than difficult.The illustration (page 63, Chariots for Apollo) depicts side-mounted landing engines in addition to the main propulsion engines located at the rear of the spacecraft. This configuration requires a separate, complex rocket system as opposed to a simple, inert ladder. Of course this side-landing configuration might have provided the crew with a better sight picture during the landing phase, in addition to making access to the lunar surface less harrowing than climbing on a 65 foot ladder. |
Skytrotter
Member Posts: 31
From: Indianapolis, IN USA
Registered: Sep 2013
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posted 05-29-2015 09:13 AM
Here's the Chariots of Apollo page showing the side landing craft. |
taneal1
Member Posts: 237
From: Orlando, FL
Registered: Feb 2004
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posted 06-02-2015 01:05 AM
quote:
Originally posted by HistoryDiscussion:
The original 1961 direct ascent approach for the lunar missions proposed that the Apollo CSM be utilized as a lunar lander with an extra stage added on the back of the Service Module.
Jay, per a number of Max Faget interviews, the last design before switching to the LM included a lunar "crasher" stage that would brake from orbit down to an altitude of 10,000 feet. It would then detach and fall to the lunar surface. A small 'lander-stage' would then carry the CSM to a touchdown on the lunar surface. Following completion of surface activities the SM would propel the CSM on a direct trajectory to Earth. quote:
Obviously a long lander was to be used.
The photos and drawings indicate that the height of the lander-stage itself would be 20-25 tall — considerably shorter than previous configurations that did not utilize the 'Crasher'. So the crew exit from a side hatch would be about 50 feet above the surface. quote:
Does anyone know how the astronauts were suppose to egress from the CSM to the lunar surface?
Very early plans show a hatch at the CM apex (with a collapsible airlock!) and three side hatches for ejection seats. I believe that when the plans for a land-landing were dropped, a single side hatch was used. It's unclear as to which hatch would be used for Lunar EVA. A proposed plan for the early LM was to descend/climb via a knotted rope. The astronauts vetoed that idea after attempting it with what was called a "Peter Pan" rig. I imagine a CSM Lander would have ended up with some sort of a ladder arrangement. quote:
But the astronauts when landing would be laying on their backs with the exit hatch positioned over their heads.
Very early landing configurations used a dual periscope system, but it was considered inadequate as was a TV camera. According to designer Max Faget, they had never settled on a configuration that would have provided the crew with adequate visual contact with the surface. The only proposal that would have provided adequate vision involved mounting a "porch" outside the CM. The view and 'cockpit' in my opinion would bear a great resemblance to that of the LLTV. The designers didn't like this idea, but agreed it would have been feasible. The other two astronauts would be on their backs looking up and traveling backwards... quote:
Was there ever a proposal for a second exit hatch for lunar excursions to be positioned at the feet of the astronauts and to be accessed via the Lower Equipment Bay?
Not that I'm aware of.Despite the requirement of another hatch in the heatshield, in my opinion the navigator position in the LEB would make an ideal CDR station for a lunar landing. Open this side hatch and extend a plexiglass box to keep dust out of the spacecraft, and provide wider visual angles. Tip the standing CDR forward to allow max view for the final touchdown and install the hand controllers much like the LM. Info would be relayed verbally by one of the other astronauts as was done in the LM for the final landing phase. Like the 'front porch' idea this had to at least be feasible. I think... | |
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