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  Finding details in Apollo 11 command module

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Author Topic:   Finding details in Apollo 11 command module
aneedell
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posted 07-20-2016 04:11 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for aneedell   Click Here to Email aneedell     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Anyone who discovers anything new and/or noteworthy either on the online viewer version or the downloads of the Smithsonian 3D model of the Apollo 11 command module Columbia, I'd love to hear about it.

Robert Pearlman
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posted 07-20-2016 11:29 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Robert Pearlman   Click Here to Email Robert Pearlman     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I was exploring the lower bay and noticed there's a bright yellow stain (?) to the right of the commander's couch on the wall. Is it known what caused that, or why it is yellow?

aneedell
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posted 07-21-2016 08:35 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for aneedell   Click Here to Email aneedell     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Robert I know just the person to ask about this. I'll let you know what I find out.

Jim Behling
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posted 07-21-2016 09:57 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Jim Behling   Click Here to Email Jim Behling     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I bet a decal was removed.

Robert Pearlman
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posted 07-21-2016 09:59 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Robert Pearlman   Click Here to Email Robert Pearlman     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
It does appear, thanks to the added clarity of Allan's photos, that parts of the central decal are missing (the online browser was too low resolution to see that was a decal). The question then becomes why remove part of the decal and leave its center in place?

Fra Mauro
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posted 07-21-2016 10:25 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Fra Mauro   Click Here to Email Fra Mauro     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Theory — outside of the decal was plastic and wore/torn off. The center looks metallic — more durable.

Steven Kaplan
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posted 07-21-2016 10:42 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Steven Kaplan   Click Here to Email Steven Kaplan     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Second theory — area was cleaned with a solvent before decal was affixed, hence the discoloration surrounding the decal.

aneedell
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posted 07-21-2016 11:05 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for aneedell   Click Here to Email aneedell     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Interesting, and possibly even relevant, there's a discussion of that decal [CM/LM PRESSURE EQUALIZATION] and an anomaly in the procedure for equalizing the pressure bewtween the CM and LM in the transcripts. Look at the A11 Apollo flight Journal beginning at 003:43:50.

Skytrotter
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posted 07-21-2016 12:16 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Skytrotter   Click Here to Email Skytrotter     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
"It's nothing. Outgassing. Don't worry about it."

aneedell
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posted 07-21-2016 12:51 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for aneedell   Click Here to Email aneedell     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Not worrying, just looking for a reason one of the astronauts might have messed with the CM/LM Pressure Equalization decal.

wdw
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posted 07-22-2016 04:23 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for wdw     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Third theory (more hypothesis really). Volatiles from the adhesive used to affix the decal have migrated through the surrounding paintwork, discolouring it.

aneedell
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posted 07-22-2016 04:12 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for aneedell   Click Here to Email aneedell     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Best extract I could make.

SpaceAholic
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posted 07-22-2016 07:43 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for SpaceAholic   Click Here to Email SpaceAholic     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
The panel is part of the Environmental Control Unit (ECU) assembly. An example on this end does not exhibit similar deterioration.

To further muddy the waters however will offer an alternative hypothesis - Columbia's ECU cover discoloration appears proximate with the location of a Glycol line just behind that point. (I've indicated its location in the second attached image of my assembly).

If that line were to leak and release the Glycol (Ethylene Glycol) decomposition to glycolic acid will occur which may have played a role. The original leak might have been triggered on mission or intentionally post-recovery to drain the ECU. Subsequent attempts at conservation to clean up the acidic material off the label and surrounding area may have further contributed to the current condition of the panel.

aneedell
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posted 07-22-2016 09:24 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for aneedell   Click Here to Email aneedell     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Here's another issue. If you use the 3D Smithsonian viewer to look under the seats, you'll see locker A1. See the stowage locker hotspot article for a diagram. Was locker A2 not installed or removed after splashdown, or was it missed in stitching together the 3D model?

NOTE that the Apollo 11 stowage list does not list anything assigned to locker A2.

SpaceAholic
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posted 07-22-2016 11:07 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for SpaceAholic   Click Here to Email SpaceAholic     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
It appears that locker A2 was not uploaded as the Apollo 11 CASHUR does not reflect its required removal with the rest of the "A" series containers (PDF pages 26 through 28 germane)

CMikeW
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posted 07-23-2016 05:33 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for CMikeW     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
My guess is that the discoloration is caused by long term effets of the process used to prepare the area for attaching the decal to the panel surface. The decals used were mostly "metalcals." The info was printed/screened onto a very thin Aluminium substrate.

Additionally the "paint" used for the internal surfaces of the Apollo CM was a very special fireproof material or at least it did not support combustion.

SpaceAholic
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posted 07-23-2016 07:22 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for SpaceAholic   Click Here to Email SpaceAholic     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
This image taken onboard Hornet the day of recovery (S69-21976) suggests that post flight conservation efforts contributed to the damage (or alternatively the cover installed today on the ECU is not the original).

Note the full label is intact and that for example the top left of the label is delaminated on Hornet but in the 3D image is now reaffixed while the top right of the label is attached (onboard Hornet) but abraided away in the NASM 3D scan.

oly
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posted 07-23-2016 11:07 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for oly   Click Here to Email oly     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
If I can offer a theory.

To me it looks like the original placard may have been rubbed or lifted during flight from interference with the seat harness. It looks as if the metal fittings would rub against this during use. It then may be the case that efforts have been made to re-attach the placard using some type of adhesive, perhaps during a restoration or preservation process. The area may have been swabbed of wiped with a solvent to prep the area for such work or alternatively may have had excess adhesive cleaned off leaving a residue that has subsequently yellowed with age?

LM-12
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posted 08-11-2016 04:44 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for LM-12     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Where is the Apollo 11 command module spacecraft identification plate located? I believe the CM spacecraft 107 part number is V36-000002-111.

There is an ID plate under window 4. Is that it?

The part number on the Grumman LM-5 ID plate is LDW280-54000-9.

aneedell
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posted 08-21-2016 11:12 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for aneedell   Click Here to Email aneedell     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Here are images that show the tag.

LM-12
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posted 08-22-2016 12:05 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for LM-12     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I see the part numbers match. Thank you.

space1
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posted 08-22-2016 06:59 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for space1   Click Here to Email space1     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Here is a pre-flight view of the Apollo 11 left LEB area (S69-36315, part of a series showing some stowage options). (Note the face drawn on the "Food Holder" label, probably drawn by someone thinking no one would ever see it anyway. Surprise!)

The lower left part of this image shows the area near the label:

The dark shadow of the food preparation shelf obscures some of this area. But we can see that since that time the structure has suffered considerable abrasion. The abrasion affects a large area and is worst at the upper right corner of the ECU cover panel and the adjoining "hard" structural aluminum rail above the ECU.

Also note a pouch is in place over the yellow bordered label. This probably has no connection with what we are seeing today, but still noteworthy.

aneedell
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posted 08-22-2016 08:51 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for aneedell   Click Here to Email aneedell     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Note: To avoid confusion, these Space1 images are of the "yellow stain" area, not the ID Tag location. The before and after images will be important for the conservators when CM 107 is moved to the preservation facility for treatment late this year.

SpaceAholic
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posted 08-22-2016 10:09 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for SpaceAholic   Click Here to Email SpaceAholic     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Before and after launch, or recovery?

Any emerging consensus from the NASM conservation staff on causation (of the staining)?

space1
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posted 08-22-2016 01:11 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for space1   Click Here to Email space1     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
The yellow stain label should not even be in that location. The label regarding CSM/LM pressure equalization is near the docking tunnel, at the pressure control valve and gauge (at the center of this image - I can't get a better view from the 3D viewer):

There would be no operational reason to place such a label against the wall next to the couch. An Apollo 13 post-flight recovery image shows that left LEB area with no such label. The Apollo 11 recovery image (far above in this thread) shows a peeling label that I think might have been put in place during the flight or shortly before. It has not been "installed" in the proper way that other labels have been. Other Apollo 11 recovery images do not show this area well.

Perhaps the yellow staining is associated with attempts to remove the label since it really isn't supposed to be there.

It appears the source of that label at that location on Apollo 11 is a mystery.

aneedell
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posted 08-22-2016 01:54 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for aneedell   Click Here to Email aneedell     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I found better (intriguing) images of the decals under the docking tunnel.

Notice that to the left of part 2 of the decal it looks like another decal was removed, almost corresponding to the decal attached near the CMD seat.

From page 21 of the Technical Air To Ground Apollo 11 transcript (The decal section over the yellow stain is only part 1 and doesn't go up to step 13):

Roger. We're working on the pressurization of the LM now, and working off the decal with CSM-LM pressure equalization. And we're down to step 13, where we're waiting for the cabin pressure to be 5, or it should be roughly 5, before we turn the REPRESS package 02 valve to FILL. Instead of 5, we're running about 4.4. Over.

aneedell
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posted 08-22-2016 03:47 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for aneedell   Click Here to Email aneedell     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Looking carefully at the two (steps 1-8) decals (below docking tunnel and by the CMD seat, they are different. Upper decal step 4 says "Direct O2 vlv - OPEN until CAB PRESS..." The Yellow Stain decal step 4 is "Direct O2 vlv - CLOSE (verify)."

Anyone have time to search the flight plan for the explanation of when each was to be followed?

aneedell
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posted 08-22-2016 03:58 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for aneedell   Click Here to Email aneedell     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Looking even more closely: The yellow stain decal goes from number 1-8. The decal up and to the left near the docking tunnel goes from number 1-9.

The decal with step 13 begins with number 9 (duplicating what is above). Seems the yellow stain decal was originally to the left of the decal with step 13, no?

space1
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posted 08-22-2016 04:33 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for space1   Click Here to Email space1     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I think if we look at the yellow stained label even more closely, we can see the word "OPEN" below the word "stable." It appears to be missing almost all of Step 9.

Meanwhile, the replacement label in your hi-res images goes to the first line of Step 9 only. The complete step is on the next label. Possibly the border tape around the label was expected to cover all of Step 9 on the first label. (Or the step was repeated on the continuation label for completeness, as in "continuing with Step 9...")

Otherwise I am convinced that the yellow stained label came from the area where a label was removed, to the left of the continuation label. And I think this happened before flight, as the replacement label is in position. Although I don't know why it wouldn't have been put in the place of the original. Maybe Apollo 11 flew with both labels in place near the docking tunnel? And Neil removed the old label in flight?? Or maybe the new label wouldn't fit in the old label's place.

It's also worth noting that the yellow stain label says "CYRO" where the new label correctly says "CRYO."

space1
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posted 08-22-2016 04:56 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for space1   Click Here to Email space1     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
The same series of pre-flight photos shows the tunnel area:

The pad of paper (labeled Rendezvous Procedures) hides the area of interest. But the labels in the hi-res images go outside the area covered by the paper. So the labels were not yet in place when this photo was taken (date not known).

LM-12
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posted 08-27-2016 09:10 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for LM-12     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by aneedell:
Here are images that show the tag.
I am somewhat surprised that the CM-107 ID plate does not have the North American Aviation name and logo on it.

LM-12
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posted 08-27-2016 12:48 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for LM-12     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Here is 16mm Magazine 1118-B from the Apollo Flight Journal. The decal can be seen at 1:22 and the ID plate can be seen at 1:27 in the film.

aneedell
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posted 08-27-2016 08:23 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for aneedell   Click Here to Email aneedell     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I suspect 03953 means NAA.

LM-12
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posted 08-27-2016 08:58 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for LM-12     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I figured it would look similar to the NAA ID plate seen at top left on the protective guard around the hatch in photo KSC-69PC-0295.

space1
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posted 08-27-2016 10:18 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for space1   Click Here to Email space1     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
03953 is the CAGE (Contractor And Government Entity) Code for North American Aviation. It is often seen as the prefix for the serial numbers found on most Apollo and Space Shuttle hardware.

aneedell
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posted 08-29-2016 08:40 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for aneedell   Click Here to Email aneedell     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
The "protective guard" with the ID tag in the KSC image in not part of the flown spacecraft. That can be seen comparing the image with the 3D view.

LM-12
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posted 09-15-2016 06:37 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for LM-12     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Note the location of the "CSM/LM Pressure Equalization" and "Press Integrity Check" instruction decals in Apollo 13 post-flight CM photo S70-15961. They are near window 1 and below Panel 326.

There are two similar decals in the same location in Apollo 11 post-flight CM photo S69-21976 posted upthread on 07-23-2016.

The "CSM/LM Pressure Equalization" decal I am referring to and the yellow-stain decal look like "T&D" instructions. The decal in the tunnel is an "LOD" instruction.

T&D = transposition & docking
LOD = lunar orbit docking (my guess)

aneedell
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posted 09-16-2016 09:34 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for aneedell   Click Here to Email aneedell     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Images of the decals in Columbia:

LM-12
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posted 09-16-2016 09:50 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for LM-12     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I see the decal says "TLD" and not T&D. Perhaps "TLD" means translunar docking (another guess on my part). The yellow-stain decal seems to match steps 1 to 8 in the "TLD" decal photos above, including the "CYRO" error.

It would seem there are two different CSM/LM pressure equalization instructions:

  • CSM/LM Pressure Equalization (TLD) - Steps 1 to 16
  • CSM/LM Pressure Equalization (LOD) - Steps 1 to 9

aneedell
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posted 09-18-2016 02:40 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for aneedell   Click Here to Email aneedell     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
The labels are visible but not readable in the image posted above by Scott (SpaceAholic) on 7-23-2016 (S69-21976) which shows them as well as the yellow stain decal. The positioning of all these decals related to specific mission tasks might make for an interesting essay about astronaut assignments and mission planning.

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